Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by vaderito on Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:59 pm

I'm not worried about CT. Like, everyone expected RJ to be the Lord and Savior and he's the one who isn't interested in romance. So...
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by Mrs Ben Solo on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:00 pm

@vaderito wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:Honestly, I think Colin delivering Reylo in any respect will earn him sexism criticism and throwbacks to Jurassic World complaints. I'm still thinking there's no way canon Reylo, even if it's amazingly done, is avoiding complaint articles about "abuse" and "sexism" and "ruining Rey" by having her "responsible for the redemption of the bad white man who hurt her". It's best to get used to the idea now.
@ZioRen

Those articles mean nothing. JW had them and made 1.6 billion. BatB had them and made 1.2 billion. GA doesn't care.

Also, guess which PT movie made the most money? That's right, the one starring Jar Jar. They removed Jar Jar from sequels due to insane media backlash and boxoffice went down never to reach TPM heights. Media backlash doesn't mean squat.
@vaderito

I'm not sure cutting down Jar Jar Binks' role had anything to do with the declining box office. TPM got hyped up to the skies like TFA, and both were a return to the SW saga movies after a long absence. TLJ likely won't do the kind of business TFA did and Ep IX probably even less. That's pretty commonplace for movie trilogies. Media backlash does sometimes have a negative impact on box office but not always. It didn't hurt Jurassic World but Chris Pratt couldn't save Passengers.

I don't expect Lucasfilm to drop CT or anything. People keep going on about Josh Trank but he didn't lose out because Fantastic Four tanked, he got blacklisted because he badmouthed the studio and went against them. I do expect Ep IX to be dogged by rumours of script/production problems because the critics are already sharpening the knives. But, as we know well, Star Wars is always subject to this kind of speculation. I am worried that if the experience of making it is awful, let alone what the finished product will be like, it might put off some of the cast from continuing (if that is the plan). I'll be watching and listening to what AD has to say, in particular, as Kylo/Ben is the character I care most about.
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by tukicarreno on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:01 pm

@IoJovi wrote:
As far as Colin goes, I'm reserving judgement until I actually see IX. A bad movie doesn't mean necessarily hinge on the director and it could be related to anything. Also, from what I gather he wasn't the writer of actual script, so there's that.

Exactly. I will reserve judgement until IX is here. Plus at least Colin repeated many times he wasn´t doing IX on his own, he mentioned it was a collaborative effort and named all the LF people, plus Rian and JJ.
If it was up to me though, I would bring back JJ to direct IX and close the trilogy. With JJ you really can´t go wrong. He has the experience to create a great closing chapter plus it seems he is totally Pro Reylo too! Smile

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by ZioRen on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:11 pm

They won't drop Colin but from what we've seen with Rogue One, they aren't afraid to get other people in there to rework things they think may not work after they get audience reactions for TLJ, etc.
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by IoJovi on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:12 pm

@vaderito wrote:I'm not worried about CT. Like, everyone expected RJ to be the Lord and Savior and he's the one who isn't interested in romance. So...
@vaderito

Not to rehash an old topic, but I really do take Rian Johnson's words with a very large grain of salt for multitude of reasons. We all know Reylo is a slow burn romance to begin with, and Ben's backstory is probably going to take forefront in VIII. I also see them playing up Reylo as the actual twist as let's face it, much of the GA who do not pay attention spoilers/tweets/etc. still think Rey is Luke's daughter.

So I'm not really too worried about this.

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by Mrs Ben Solo on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:19 pm

@IoJovi wrote:
@vaderito wrote:I'm not worried about CT. Like, everyone expected RJ to be the Lord and Savior and he's the one who isn't interested in romance. So...
@vaderito

Not to rehash an old topic, but I really do take Rian Johnson's words with a very large grain of salt for multitude of reasons. We all know Reylo is a slow burn romance to begin with, and Ben's backstory is probably going to take forefront in VIII. I also see them playing up Reylo as the actual twist as let's face it, much of the GA who do not pay attention spoilers/tweets/etc. still think Rey is Luke's daughter.

So I'm not really too worried about this.
@IoJovi

Also, RJ did not say he wasn't interested in romance. He said he would have loved to do a big central romance but it didn't feel right for where the characters were at. IMO, he's right because none of the main characters were in a place for a Han & Leia type central love story at the end of TFA. For all we know, RJ could well be the one who is manoeuvring all the players to a point where full-blown romance is a possibility in Ep IX. The Vanity Fair article didn't rule out romance and a few heated looks and UST interactions can go a long way.
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by IoJovi on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:23 pm

@Mrs Ben Solo wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:
@vaderito wrote:I'm not worried about CT. Like, everyone expected RJ to be the Lord and Savior and he's the one who isn't interested in romance. So...
@vaderito

Not to rehash an old topic, but I really do take Rian Johnson's words with a very large grain of salt for multitude of reasons. We all know Reylo is a slow burn romance to begin with, and Ben's backstory is probably going to take forefront in VIII. I also see them playing up Reylo as the actual twist as let's face it, much of the GA who do not pay attention spoilers/tweets/etc. still think Rey is Luke's daughter.

So I'm not really too worried about this.
@IoJovi

Also, RJ did not say he wasn't interested in romance. He said he would have loved to do a big central romance but it didn't feel right for where the characters were at. IMO, he's right because none of the main characters were in a place for a Han & Leia type central love story at the end of TFA. For all we know, RJ could well be the one who is manoeuvring all the players to a point where full-blown romance is a possibility in Ep IX. The Vanity Fair article didn't rule out romance and a few heated looks and UST interactions can go a long way.
@Mrs Ben Solo

EXACTLY!!!! Jumping

What Rian is basically doing is maneuvering these characters (in JJ's words, two disparaging pieces) to line up to where a romance can blossom. What's needed to do that is both an expansion on Ben's backstory and understanding on Rey's part (ie, sharing multiple scenes together).
It's completely understandable here why a Han and Leia type romance wouldn't work in this case. Han and Leia were never enemies on two opposing sides. Leia never witnessed Han doing the unimaginable. Leia never gave Han a facial scar in retaliation.

They'll get to that point though - I have no doubts on that.

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by Mrs Ben Solo on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:27 pm

@snufkin Colin Trevorrow never even got to meet Carrie, so she won't have been anywhere near the Ep IX script! Sad
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by TheLastJedi on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:32 pm

Someone made this on twitter

https://twitter.com/jasonosia/status/875407831108898816?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

The movie for kids perspective seems kind of scary now.
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by snufkin on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:35 pm

@Mrs Ben Solo wrote:@snufkin Colin Trevorrow never even got to meet Carrie, so she won't have been anywhere near the Ep IX script! :(
@Mrs Ben Solo

I'm assuming if she hadn't passed, she'd be part of the production. And stories that came out after her death was that she gave story notes to JJ Abrams, plus Johnson says in the Vanity Fair interview that he spent time during pre-production and production at her homes in Southern California and London reviewing and editing the script. She was already playing a role as a writer, besides just playing that character. The loss of her to the ST is more about the loss of her as a writer, besides playing Leia and the friendships she had with the creative team and other cast members (both from the OT and ST). There will be other writers who have input/control over IX. Especially with a strong story group and JJ/Rian still involved in some capacity. But she won't be one of them, that's what's a heart breaker.


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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by IoJovi on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:35 pm

@TheLastJedi wrote:Someone made this on twitter

https://twitter.com/jasonosia/status/875407831108898816?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

The movie for kids perspective seems kind of scary now.
@TheLastJedi

lol! I couldn't finish it. It hurt my brain too much after awhile...

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by TheLastJedi on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:40 pm

@IoJovi wrote:
@TheLastJedi wrote:Someone made this on twitter

https://twitter.com/jasonosia/status/875407831108898816?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

The movie for kids perspective seems kind of scary now.
@TheLastJedi

lol! I couldn't finish it. It hurt my brain too much after awhile...
@IoJovi

The end is the best part though Laughing Laughing
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by IoJovi on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:44 pm

@TheLastJedi wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:
@TheLastJedi wrote:Someone made this on twitter

https://twitter.com/jasonosia/status/875407831108898816?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

The movie for kids perspective seems kind of scary now.
@TheLastJedi

lol! I couldn't finish it. It hurt my brain too much after awhile...
@IoJovi

The end is the best part though Laughing Laughing
@TheLastJedi

lol! Okay, on your recommendation, I watched it again. Maybe someday I'll understand what the heck just happened...

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by snufkin on Thu Jun 15, 2017 1:55 pm

Maybe it's because they used the same kid actor, but the whole aggressively quirky kid in old timey goggles photo does make me want to go re-watch Midnight Special. Which manages to channel Spielberg in a way that's not quite as hagiographic as JJ's 8 MM or what this movie clearly tried to go for and seems to have failed pretty spectacularly at.

And damn, Film Twitter has him on full blast. Like they really really HATE him and are dragging the reviews and its potential impact on IX, with some comments about hiring Patty Jenkins instead. I'd guess it's not just because of the quality of JW and this movie, it's the whole issue of patronage and Old Boy's Club because he got in with KK and her husband thanks to Brad Bird's "he reminds me of me as a young filmmaker" recommendation.

Jessica Ritchey wrote:Experience is the miserable Catch-22 that’s been slowly strangling blockbusters with increasingly unfortunate results for the past twenty some years. It’s what the fear and resentment of women and directors of color touching beloved toys cloaks itself in so it can’t get called out. Oh no, the problem isn’t that the director isn’t a white man, not at all, you’re just deeply concerned that they don’t have enough experience for a job. As if every new job doesn’t begin with a learning curve of some kind. As if some of their favorite directors didn’t go through baptisms of fire learning the ropes on their first big break. In a candid interview with The Verge, Trevorrow frankly admits how much of this was new to him: “I had to be a method director. I had to almost play the role of myself 20 years from now, with far more experience and far more knowledge, and I went method the whole damn time.” There is plenty honorable in the tradition of Fake It Till You Make It, but it’s grown tiresome in how that window of grace is sealed shut to any person who doesn’t remind a big name director of a younger, scrappier version of themselves.

Why is one indie film deemed a good enough reason to get handed the keys to a major franchise if you’re a white man, but a CV of several films or several seasons of some of the most prestige cable TV series leaves you ill-prepared to handle dinosaurs and superheroes? Going back to MacLaren: she’s only in the running for the “Star Wars” job after the first director, Josh Trank, got the boot. Allegedly, Trank was dropped over his “erratic” behavior during filming of the upcoming “Fantastic Four.” In Alex Pappademas’ enlightening and eyebrow-raising Grantland piece* about Trank and Trevorrow, he writes how Trank was another quantum leaper to a blockbuster’s control panel having only helmed another indie, “Chronicle,” before getting the “Fantastic Four” reboot. Pappademas writes about Hollywood’s love affair with giving breaks to greenhorn male directors archly: “Sometimes it’s just that easy. You get a phone call one day, which leads to a meeting with Spielberg, and poof - you’re a T. Rex wrangler. Directorially speaking, this is Schwab’s Pharmacy stuff.” Pappademas' use of the Schwab’s legend feels especially sharp; after all, in that bit of Tinsel Town lore, it’s a woman who is discovered sipping a drink at the soda fountain.

The difference with Rian Johnson is that they see him as one of their own with the film nerd references for TLJ, being the partner (which they both try to downplay for obvious reasons) of a well respected film historian and podcaster, and a resume that includes Breaking Bad. Regardless of the quality of films and how much people are being fair versus a**holes, it's really the patronage part that really has brought the knives out. And it does make their earlier comment about the supposed risk in hiring a female director look more than foolish with the kudos for Jenkins and excitement being for upcoming films from Ryan Coogler, Ava DuVernay, and Taika Waititi. And while there's a lot to respect/praise KK for as the person in charge of LF and the ST, there is a certain amount of criticism due to her role in perpetuating the mini-Spielberg model as the film industry tries to recreate a blockbuster model from the 1980s, right down to picking and promoting directors who emulate him.

*
Alex Pappademas wrote:Trevorrow has a called-up-from-the-minors story improbable enough to inspire any would-be auteur to power through another day pulling cable or filling burrito bowls. Imagine: You make a tinyish movie that plays festivals, gets decent reviews, and wins a few awards. Not a lot of people see it, but one of those people is Brad Bird, who likes it a lot. Some time later, Lucasfilm offers Bird Star Wars Episode VII: The Force Awakens. Bird is just beginning production on Tomorrowland when he gets this call, and ultimately that’s the project he’ll stick with. But there’s a brief moment when he’s flirting with the somewhat absurd idea of doing both back-to-back, and during that period, since he can’t realistically prep two massive special-effects movies simultaneously, he suggests using a stand-in director to get Episode VII up and running and ready to shoot while he goes off and makes Tomorrowland. The stand-in he suggests is you, Mr. $750,000 Time-Travel Movie Guy.

Obviously this is never going to happen, but Lucasfilm president Kathleen Kennedy talks about it to her husband, producer Frank Marshall, who cofounded Amblin Entertainment with Kennedy and Steven Spielberg in 1981 and is now looking for somebody to direct a revival of Spielberg’s Jurassic Park franchise. “I said, well, okay … who is this guy?” Marshall told Slashfilm in April. “So, we screened [Safety Not Guaranteed] and I kind of saw what Brad was thinking.” Sometimes it’s just that easy. You get a phone call one day, which leads to a meeting with Spielberg, and poof — you’re a T. rex wrangler. Directorially speaking, this is Schwab’s Pharmacy stuff. This is Harrison Ford, sometime actor and full-time carpenter, agreeing to read lines at a casting session as a favor to his buddy George Lucas and walking out with the role of Han Solo. You never know. And despite everything we do know about the business of movies, we still want to believe that Hollywood (and by extension the world) occasionally works like this — that sometimes it opens the books for nobodies who dared to dream, that if you keep a song in your heart and a smile as your umbrella there will one day be a call incoming from some gatekeeper who digs the cut of your jib...Every time we assign some budding nerd-auteur a cinematic book report on the genius of Stan Lee or entrust them with a small corner of George Lucas’s cosmos to putter around in, we take a potential maker of universes and turn him into a middle manager.2 (Him or her, I should say, although as Manohla Dargis pointed out last year in the New York Times, virtually every beneficiary of this practice has been a dude; somehow, female directors never remind the Spielbergs and Brad Birds of the world of themselves.)

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by BenOrgana on Fri Jun 16, 2017 6:22 am

This is ... really not looking good. https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/the_book_of_henry/

Especially when you have critics now openly questioning whether this guy should be anywhere near Star Wars. This is going to dog the buzz around the franchise from now until IX is finally released. Yikes.

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by Kessel on Fri Jun 16, 2017 7:39 am

@BenOrgana wrote:This is ... really not looking good. https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/the_book_of_henry/

Especially when you have critics now openly questioning whether this guy should be anywhere near Star Wars. This is going to dog the buzz around the franchise from now until IX is finally released. Yikes.
@BenOrgana

Yeah, the reviews are really bad, across the board...I hadn't really planned to watch the movie in the cinema, but I will now; just so I can form my own opinion, but yeah...

It will be interesting to see if it will prompt KK and LF to take any kind of action in repsonse.
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by Darth Dingbat on Fri Jun 16, 2017 8:10 am

So should we call this ColinGate or TrevorrowGate? Razz
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by IoJovi on Fri Jun 16, 2017 8:12 am

@Darth Dingbat wrote:So should we call this ColinGate or TrevorrowGate? Razz
@Darth Dingbat

I don't know. I do know that I want to see this movie if only for sheer morning curiosity.

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by Darth Rowan on Fri Jun 16, 2017 8:27 am

People complaining about the boy's crush being reduced to a prop for the duration of the movie and then being given a larger than life moment of spotlight that came off as ridiculous instead of grand - Kind of like outrunning a dinosaur in stilettos? It sounds like Book of Henry has the same difficulty that JW did with the characterization of women. There's a theme here. :/

The Atlantic's review of the movie. Spoiler free although it touches on the main themes. "Watching this movie is like eating a cake baked with salt instead of sugar" is the mildest thing said.

Trevorrow is being savaged over this. I almost feel bad for him, though I've always disliked and resented him. (Yes I tried watching Safety Not Guaranteed.)Been thinking it's a terrible idea that he is helming 9 from the moment it was announced, but damn this is one time I desperately wish to be proven wrong. I think LF knew of the hate by some of us because even before this disaster of Book of Henry they were putting out hints that he's being carefully monitored with 9. Let's see what they do with this.

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by Kylo Rey on Fri Jun 16, 2017 8:40 am

Somebody on Twitter compared this to The Room, omg. Anyway, I always hated the idea of Trevorrow directing a Star Wars movie, as Jurassic World was fun but mediocre at best. I mean how do you go from JJ Abrams and Rian Johnson to this??? Most great directors have something to separate them from the rest but Trevorrow is literally the epitome of blandness, has no vision/ambition, lack of visual style etc. Disney should fire him and give Episode 9 to someone more capable. Miguel Sapochnik for example would be a great pick, his work on S5 and S6 of Game of Thrones was stunning, and he delivered two of the greatest episodes of TV ever with BoTB and Winds of Winter (they looked better than a lot of Blockbuster films).
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by BenOrgana on Fri Jun 16, 2017 8:42 am

Yeah, this isn't getting "mixed reviews" or being treated as a noble failure - it's an absolute catastrophe on every level. This is not going to please the money-men at Lucasfilm or Disney ...

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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by spacebaby45678 on Fri Jun 16, 2017 8:46 am

Maybe they can bring Uncle George back for 9... study



On a more serious note, I hated the Jurassic reboot, I am not surprised by his Henry reviews, Gareth was only Meh for me ..and I know this is probably sacrilege around here but I am not that big on RJ's Looper, I don't see how it translates, I want to be proven wrong. Koogler has did the damn thing with BPanther, rumors are that the set has been difficult and strained because of his insistence on his own team and strains of perfectionism, Chadwick is also a perfectionist but you can feel that energy in the teaser.

Did someone say Patty Jenkins for 9


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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by SoloSideCousin on Fri Jun 16, 2017 9:44 am

I just read Kurt Loder's review on Reason.com. (I can't link it because I am on my phone ... Also with our talk of the 80s in the other thread, the older among us might remember Kurt Loder from MTV:-)). The review was of course terrible, but in it he brought up an interesting point about changing directors.

Apparently, Neil Blomkamp, of District 9 fame, was slated cor an Alien movie. Then he did Elysium and Chappie, and suddenly the studio took it away from him. I never saw Chappie, but Elysium, though certainly  nothing to "write home about", was watchable and not terrible. Also District 9 was a very strong movie.  Further, Alien, though a major almost 40 year old franchise itself with tins of cultural resonance, is still not at SW level. She could move IX to December 2019 and let him go.

If he f**** up the franchise because she kept him, all of the blame will be at her door.
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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by WhatGirl on Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:02 am

The critical reception of the film makes Colin's statements from 2015 quite interesting:



Question wrote:“Is it theoretically possible that the studios have approached some of these women, only to be shot down? Sure. But the fact that their names never crop up in the rumours or shortlists that circulate before any big announcement is telling.”

Trevorrow wrote:“The last thing I’d want to communicate is that I don’t acknowledge this problem exists. I think the problem is glaring and obvious. And while it does make me a little uncomfortable to be held up as an example of everything that’s wrong, this is an important dialogue to have, so let’s have it.

Would I have been chosen to direct Jurassic World if I was a female film-maker who had made one small film? I have no idea. I’d like to think that choice was based on the kind of story I told and the way I chose to tell it. But of course it’s not that simple. There are centuries-old biases at work at every level, within all of us. And yes, it makes me feel s*** to be perceived as part of this problem, because it’s an issue that matters so much to me. If I didn’t care, I wouldn’t talk about it in the first place.

“I do stand by the idea that a great many people in the film industry want this to change. I have made attempts at every turn to help turn the tide, and I will continue to do it. When I got the script for Lucky Them, released last year, I advocated hard for my friend Megan Griffiths to direct. She did, and she made a wonderful film (see it please). On my next project, Book of Henry, nearly all of my department heads and producers are women. Will I give a female film-maker the same chance Steven Spielberg gave me someday? Let’s hope that when I do, it won’t even be noteworthy. It will be the status quo.”

https://www.theguardian.com/film/2015/aug/24/jurassic-world-colin-trevorrow-criticised-for-saying-women-lack-desire-to-direct-blockbusters

He seems to believe he got where he is today by sheer talent; basically he doesn't see his privilege. The most poetic solution in the face of this crisis would be to replace him with a woman director. I don't think that will happen, however. We will find out if LF is able to do anything at this stage. For those of us who never agreed with the decision of having Trevorrow direct IX, 'Book of Henry' will be far more effective in getting the problem addressed than say, an online petition signed by concerned SW fans.


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Re: Colin Trevorrow for Episode IX

Post by BenOrgana on Fri Jun 16, 2017 10:09 am

@SoloSideCousin wrote:I just read Kurt Loder's review on Reason.com. (I can't link it because I am on my phone ... Also with our talk of the 80s in the other thread, the older among us might remember Kurt Loder from MTV:-)). The review was of course terrible, but in it he brought up an interesting point about changing directors.

Apparently, Neil Blomkamp, of District 9 fame, was slated cor an Alien movie. Then he did Elysium and Chappie, and suddenly the studio took it away from him. I never saw Chappie, but Elysium, though certainly  nothing to "write home about", was watchable and not terrible. Also District 9 was a very strong movie.  Further, Alien, though a major almost 40 year old franchise itself with tins of cultural resonance, is still not at SW level. She could move IX to December 2019 and let him go.

If he f**** up the franchise because she kept him, all of the blame will be at her door.
@SoloSideCousin

Oh yeah, it's all on KK now, because she can't say she wasn't warned. People have been sceptical about Trevorrow since the start.

BenOrgana
Jedi Youngling
Jedi Youngling

Messages : 26
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Date d'inscription : 2017-01-18

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