Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sat 21 May - 16:17

@FrolickingFizzgig: Exactly.

@vaderito: Yeah, sure... the much-talked-of character development Wink All I'm saying is, if that's the way they're going they should probably laid some groundwork for that in TFA. Which they didn't. We didn't even get to see Kylo struggling with leadership issues. We mostly saw him torn apart by an internal conflict that was woven into a mysterious awakening of the Force. But hey, who knows. Maybe this trilogy really will be all over the place, with no unifying theme whatsoever.

And again, I repeat: this man killed Han Solo. His own father. Is that really going to be swept under the carpet?

Look: my specialty is the Wars of the Roses. Nothing would please the geek in me more than to see a Wars of the Roses in space, with people getting beheaded left and right and widows getting richer as they remarry and remarry because their pesky husbands keep dying on the battlefield. But I would have preferred to get some hints in TFA that this is where the trilogy is going. Instead, we got something totally different.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by vaderito on Sat 21 May - 16:18

@Mana wrote:My Reympress,
My love,
The light of my life,
What is thy bidding?
(but I'm warning you, sometimes I let my personal interests get in the way of orders.....)

@Mana



@Darth Dingbat Patricide/fratricide/othercide were no problem with many great monarchs. They all had skeletons in the closet. That's why history remembers them.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sat 21 May - 16:23

@Darth Dingbat wrote:@FrolickingFizzgig: Exactly.

@vaderito: Yeah, sure... the much-talked-of character development Wink All I'm saying is, if that's the way they're going they should probably laid some groundwork for that in TFA. Which they didn't. We didn't even get to see Kylo struggling with leadership issues. We mostly saw him torn apart by an internal conflict that was woven into a mysterious awakening of the Force. But hey, who knows. Maybe this trilogy really will be all over the place, with no unifying theme whatsoever.

And again, I repeat: this man killed Han Solo. His own father. Is that really going to be swept under the carpet?

Look: my specialty is the Wars of the Roses. Nothing would please the geek in me more than to see a Wars of the Roses in space, with people getting beheaded left and right and widows getting richer as they remarry and remarry because their pesky husbands keep dying on the battlefield. But I would have preferred to get some hints in TFA that this is where the trilogy is going. Instead, we got something totally different.
@Darth Dingbat
Yep, I dislike Renperor for exactly the same reason I dislike(d) the now dead Rey Skywalker theory. The groundworks were simply not there. It would be very bad writing (to me). Star Wars has never been an overly complex series with all over the place writing and shock-value twists that weren't foreshadowed or planned, and I would be really surprised if it became that all of a sudden. Star Wars has always been about the poetry in writing. The poetry that I saw in TFA leads to Kylo's delusions being further shattered as he comes to make great changes within himself, accept himself and overcome his own insecurities. That's the natural and simplest progression of the character's story. It makes the most sense because it has so much groundwork for it already.

I also can't think of a Renperor narrative that doesn't completely kick Rey out of the driver's seat, and that's a big problem.

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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sat 21 May - 16:24

@vaderito wrote:
@Darth Dingbat Patricide/fratricide/othercide were no problem with many great monarchs. They all had skeletons in the closet. That's why history remembers them.
@vaderito

Well, like I said, nothing would be please me more than seeing a space version of my beloved Wars of the Roses. By all means, plot against all your relatives and have your brothers executed or poisoned; I'm into that sort of thing. It's just that I don't much appreciate a genre switch midway through the story.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by SoloSideCousin on Sat 21 May - 16:26

@spacebaby45678 wrote:I have tons of head canon about Renperor, probably leftover exposure to the EU...

The son of Han and Leia Organa Solo, Jacen Solo was a leading Jedi Knight who proved crucial in defeating the Yuuzhan Vong and protecting the galaxy during the Yuuzhan Vong War. The grandson of Darth Vader, Darth Caedus was a Sith Lord who turned against his family and friends, betraying his former principles and leading the Galactic Alliance he once championed into a reign of terror as he attempted to bring order and stability to a fractured galaxy. It was Solo's desire to protect the galaxy and his increasing willingness to accept any cost in that cause that facilitated his fall to the Sith.

I still can't believe that Snoke is the "Big Bad" of this trilogy, and neither is Kylo... So why does Kylo feel the wieght of the Galaxy on his shoulders ( paraphrasing) TFA novelization? Does he have visions of an external threat to the Galaxy? In addition, I have to believe that Han's death was for something greater in the scheme of things....

@spacebaby45678

On the bolded, I always like that "visions of an external threat" thing too.  I have headcanon about it as well, even though I never read the EU.  At some point, if they are going to keep going, Dark and Light might need to come together whether they like it or not.  If Kylo has years of visions of there being some particular way to keep the galaxy safe *from something* and *he needs Snoke* to do that, and if he could only get to Snoke by proving himself (killing Han), then I could see that as an explanation for why he forced himself to do it.  (IMO he absolutely did not want to do it.  He didn't think he had the strength to do it).  Perhaps, he could only do it because he knows Han would want to help the galaxy? Who knows? He might even have had visions of a masked Rey as his partner in this quest.  

I think his visions could be very wrong, but I am convinced that he has had them (Vader talk) and that they are driving him.  He doesn't really seem to want to be dark.  He thinks that he *has to be* dark.  He thinks he needs the dark side for something.  I also think he and Luke could have come across some prophecy that would bolster such visions in their travels and he and Luke disagree on the meaning of the visions and the prophecy.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by vaderito on Sat 21 May - 16:31

@SoloSideCousin wrote:  

I agree that they probably won't go there, but it's not impossible.  I think the team was afraid of touching politics after GL mucked it up so much, but Bloodline displayed an interesting and nuanced view of politics IMO. And RJ was a big contributor on that.  They may trust him to handle the politics.  And frankly if I got anything out of Bloodline it was the problem of this "true believer" thing.  Leia gets cynical about politics, but then makes an extreme choice IMO based on her emotional history in the Rebellion.  The FO is obviously bad and extreme.  To me it looked like the galaxy was crying out for some Lincoln or the folks who rebuilt Germany and Japan after the war.  They need some centralized government.  They just need it to be truly contained so imperialism doesn't grow again.  That's why I like the MacArthur/Shogun thing for Ren.  He might very well be the only "can work with" person left standing on the side of the FO, and if Bloodline is any indication, the FO represents a very large constituency.  I think he would be a great transition person, especially if he and Rey worked on that transition together.  Then like George Washington he could leave it all once a system is set up ... and finally realize this sith is not his burden forever.
@SoloSideCousin

Agreed. Just because TP didn't handle politics well, it doesn't mean that new movies should completely stir clear of it or do another simplified (Empire = bad, republic = good) version.

I also don't agree that TFA laid no groundwork for Renperor. I'm not rooting for Renperor by any means but "I will finish what you started" smacks of "Together, we will rule the galaxy" or at least "will rule the galaxy" part. Also, the talk about Kylo being unpolished and unfinished villain implying he'll get polished and finished in the future. And, of course, Visual Guide. But that line to Vader's mask is something that they could build Renperor on. He kills Snoke, takes his place, gives himself a different title, blah, blah.  @Darth Dingbat @FrolickingFizzgig
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by spacebaby45678 on Sat 21 May - 16:33

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@spacebaby45678 wrote:I have tons of head canon about Renperor, probably leftover exposure to the EU...

The son of Han and Leia Organa Solo, Jacen Solo was a leading Jedi Knight who proved crucial in defeating the Yuuzhan Vong and protecting the galaxy during the Yuuzhan Vong War. The grandson of Darth Vader, Darth Caedus was a Sith Lord who turned against his family and friends, betraying his former principles and leading the Galactic Alliance he once championed into a reign of terror as he attempted to bring order and stability to a fractured galaxy. It was Solo's desire to protect the galaxy and his increasing willingness to accept any cost in that cause that facilitated his fall to the Sith.

I still can't believe that Snoke is the "Big Bad" of this trilogy, and neither is Kylo... So why does Kylo feel the wieght of the Galaxy on his shoulders ( paraphrasing) TFA novelization? Does he have visions of an external threat to the Galaxy? In addition, I have to believe that Han's death was for something greater in the scheme of things....

@spacebaby45678

On the bolded, I always like that "visions of an external threat" thing too.  I have headcanon about it as well, even though I never read the EU.  At some point, if they are going to keep going, Dark and Light might need to come together whether they like it or not.  If Kylo has years of visions of there being some particular way to keep the galaxy safe *from something* and *he needs Snoke* to do that, and if he could only get to Snoke by proving himself (killing Han), then I could see that as an explanation for why he forced himself to do it.  (IMO he absolutely did not want to do it.  He didn't think he had the strength to do it).  Perhaps, he could only do it because he knows Han would want to help the galaxy? Who knows? He might even have had visions of a masked Rey as his partner in this quest.  

I think his visions could be very wrong, but I am convinced that he has had them (Vader talk) and that they are driving him.  He doesn't really seem to want to be dark.  He thinks that he *has to be* dark.  He thinks he needs the dark side for something.  I also think he and Luke could have come across some prophecy that would bolster such visions in their travels and he and Luke disagree on the meaning of the visions and the prophecy.
@SoloSideCousin

ITA, with the bolded. Also when he says, " I know what I have to do, but I don't know if I have the strength to do it" I never thought he killed Han to be free of pain... but again, that is my interpretation ( headcanon)
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sat 21 May - 16:47

@vaderito: When I talked about groundwork, I meant more than just one line in TFA Wink I was talking more in terms of conflict and character development. Nothing in TFA laid groundwork for a plot about Kylo becoming a leader.

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
I also can't think of a Renperor narrative that doesn't completely kick Rey out of the driver's seat, and that's a big problem.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Well, exactly. If the trilogy were to make a sudden U-turn and be about one man's quest to get his act together and claim his rightful place on the throne, it would make all the other elements of the story pretty much redundant. Including the mystical Force plot and the Force-related love story that this forum is about...

Be careful what you wish for, guys. If you get Renperor, it won't be the complex and interesting story you seem to expect. It would be Darth Caedus 2.0, with angsty Reylo and a Reylo baby on the way as Kylo is tragically destroyed by his own ambition in Episode IX. But at least it would be well acted, I'll grant you that.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by vaderito on Sat 21 May - 16:51

I don't want Renperor but I'm trying to be positive in case he happens.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sat 21 May - 17:09

@vaderito wrote:I don't want Renperor but I'm trying to be positive in case he happens.
@vaderito

If we get Renperor, I want the whole hog, then. I want to see traitors hanged, drawn and quartered, and a poleaxe in the skull would be a fitting end to Kylo. That's what tends to happen to my favourite kings.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by vaderito on Sat 21 May - 17:13

@Darth Dingbat wrote:
@vaderito wrote:I don't want Renperor but I'm trying to be positive in case he happens.
@vaderito

If we get Renperor, I want the whole hog, then. I want to see traitors hanged, drawn and quartered, and a poleaxe in the skull would be a fitting end to Kylo. That's what tends to happen to my favourite kings.
@Darth Dingbat

Boo.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sat 21 May - 17:18

@vaderito wrote:
@Darth Dingbat wrote:
@vaderito wrote:I don't want Renperor but I'm trying to be positive in case he happens.
@vaderito

If we get Renperor, I want the whole hog, then. I want to see traitors hanged, drawn and quartered, and a poleaxe in the skull would be a fitting end to Kylo. That's what tends to happen to my favourite kings.
@Darth Dingbat

Boo.
@vaderito

What? I mean it, here's what they did to my most beloved king:

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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by Kessel on Sat 21 May - 17:24

I am ultimately a redemptionist and that's where I see the story going, but I totally understand the appeal of Renperor because it would be interesting to see Kylo kill Snoke, take control of everything and become this awesome and powerful emperor, something Anakin could never do; not as a dark sider, but as a grey character. Also yes, Renperor is kind of hot. But I feel Star Wars would never do this.  If Kylo becomes the Renperor, I can't see him being allowed to "carry on." Reylo would not happen and he would remain a villian and be killed off.  

Anyway, everyone here saw this foreshadowing and potential between Rey and Kylo in TFA. We know how amazing this story can be based on their dynamic. At the end of the day, I just want a good story, but I really feel a good story involves Rey and Kylo developing their relationship, overcoming each other and ultimately finding themselves in each other. I don't even know what that will look like, but in Star Wars it can't happen with an unredeemed evil Kylo.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sat 21 May - 17:29

Eek, I'm sorry guys - I apologise if I came across as too sarcastic or something. I personally don't see the foundations of a Renperor plot in TFA and it would come out of left field as far as I'm concerned, as the only things hinting at the possibility are in the Visual Dictionary and Bloodline. I also don't see how this could possibly be an optimistic story, or integrate the different elements already introduced in TFA.

But I definitely don't want to sound like I'm trying to shut down the discussion just because I don't like the idea. I'm afraid I may have sounded like that. Please carry on, folks!

(I stand by what I said, though: Wars of the Roses in space would be cool, though I'm not sure the children would like it much Wink)
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by Mana on Sat 21 May - 17:30

I think the idea of Renperor and Reympress is fascinating...but I'd like to leave that story to an alternate universe. Kylo will be redeemed.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by vaderito on Sat 21 May - 17:31

@Mana wrote:I think the idea of Renperor and Reympress is fascinating...but I'd like to leave that story to an alternate universe. Kylo will be redeemed.
@Mana

Redeemed Renperor of AU. Renperor and Reyempress.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by SoloSideCousin on Sat 21 May - 17:35

@Darth Dingbat wrote:
@vaderito wrote:
@Darth Dingbat wrote:
@vaderito wrote:I don't want Renperor but I'm trying to be positive in case he happens.
@vaderito

If we get Renperor, I want the whole hog, then. I want to see traitors hanged, drawn and quartered, and a poleaxe in the skull would be a fitting end to Kylo. That's what tends to happen to my favourite kings.
@Darth Dingbat

Boo.
@vaderito

What? I mean it, here's what they did to my most beloved king:

@Darth Dingbat

You should look up Secrets of the Dead from American PBS online.  They did a whole thing testing how Richard could be a great warrior on horseback even with the severe scoliosis.


Also you wrote earlier:
"@vaderito: When I talked about groundwork, I meant more than just one line in TFA Wink I was talking more in terms of conflict and character development. Nothing in TFA laid groundwork for a plot about Kylo becoming a leader."

I actually disagree with you a bit there.  Kylo is Snoke's special ops guy.  He has his own team on the Jakku and on Takodana.  Jakku was a reasonably successful mission from the FO POV.  Obviously not perfect because of the LST bit.  But IMO the Force stepped in for both Finn and Ren on Jakku.  I think LST started a "waking up" process for Ren.  That's why he let Finn go ... some Ben came to the surface IMO. Also, he gave Hux BB8 on a silver platter.  Hux's incompetence with his small team screwed that up.  Also, IMO, Kylo would have stood much more a fighting chance against "Ace Poe" had he not been distracted by a beautiful scavenger in the woods.  LOL.  

I don't think he's incompetent.  I think he has his own agenda, and sometimes it works with Snoke and sometimes he doesn't.  From the minute lets Finn off and particularly from the second he says, "What Girl?" he is increasingly off his game ... and I think that's because he is literally being torn apart by the dark side and light *and* because he has his "personal reasons" (aka personal agenda) regarding Luke and where Luke is that might be separate from why he is with Snoke.  I think we need to learn more before his incompetency can be totally determined.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by vaderito on Sat 21 May - 17:40

I agree with that. There's literally only one Remperortastic line in the movie and nothing else. That's still more than Rey and Poe romance set up that some podcasters (coughCollidercough) insist on. Laughing
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by SoloSideCousin on Sat 21 May - 17:52

Kessel89 wrote:I am ultimately a redemptionist and that's where I see the story going, but I totally understand the appeal of Renperor because it would be interesting to see Kylo kill Snoke, take control of everything and become this awesome and powerful emperor, something Anakin could never do; not as a dark sider, but as a grey character. Also yes, Renperor is kind of hot. But I feel Star Wars would never do this.  If Kylo becomes the Renperor, I can't see him being allowed to "carry on." Reylo would not happen and he would remain a villian and be killed off.  

Anyway, everyone here saw this foreshadowing and potential between Rey and Kylo in TFA. We know how amazing this story can be based on their dynamic. At the end of the day, I just want a good story, but I really feel a good story involves Rey and Kylo developing their relationship, overcoming each other and ultimately finding themselves in each other. I don't even know what that will look like, but in Star Wars it can't happen with an unredeemed evil Kylo.
@Kessel89

I'm a total Redemptionist.  I'll say it here and now.  Kylo and where he goes is more important to me than where Rey goes or even Reylo.  I am all about redemption, and I think Kylo having a leadership position (let's not call it Renperor) during a transition or he becomes a leader on some backwoods world during exile in Episode X and beyond could be amazing.  I just hate the idea of him completely capitulating to the Resistance, because frankly, IMO, that side has its problems too.  Bad as he has acted, he could represent that Ransolm POV from Bloodline at some point, which is a legitimate viewpoint.  I want him to be Ronin or Rogue or his own guy.  Being a Jedi is not his own guy, neither is being Snoke's puppet.  He's not his mother in this absolute believer in the Rebellion/Resistance/Some vague vision of "the way the Republic should be" either.  Bloodline says he doesn't want to be a royal figure, even though he has the chance.  He is just such an interesting character with so many possibilities.  IMO his whole story should not be about just redemption or being worthy of Rey  ... I want him to be who he was supposed to be and was never allowed to be because Luke said his darkness was wrong, his mother sent him away when she couldn't figure him out, his father didn't know what to do with him, and Snoke abused him.  He has that unique force composition for a reason.  They hired one the best actors of his generation to play him.  I want them to do something with that.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sat 21 May - 17:56

@SoloSideCousin: Richard was indeed a good example of how having guts can overcome serious physical shortcomings. Not only did he have severe scoliosis, but he was a short and by all accounts thin man who had a very delicate bone structure. Somehow this didn't stop him in battle, even against Kylo-sized opponents. The mindset required in Mediaeval warfare is something that's fascinating to me: in something as brutal as that, you need the ability to immerse yourself in a total battle trance. Once you snap out of that, you run for your life. That's how battles were lost...

@vaderito wrote:I agree with that. There's literally only one Remperortastic line in the movie and nothing else. That's still more than Rey and Poe romance set up that some podcasters (coughCollidercough) insist on. Laughing
@vaderito

Tbh, I'm a conspirator only pretending to be a Reylo. I'm really here for Emperor Poe and his Empress Rey. Please don't tell anyone.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sat 21 May - 18:00

@Darth Dingbat wrote:@SoloSideCousin: Richard was indeed a good example of how having guts can overcome serious physical shortcomings. Not only did he have severe scoliosis, but he was a short and by all accounts thin man who had a very delicate bone structure. Somehow this didn't stop him in battle, even against Kylo-sized opponents. The mindset required in Mediaeval warfare is something that's fascinating to me: in something as brutal as that, you need the ability to immerse yourself in a total battle trance. Once you snap out of that, you run for your life. That's how battles were lost...

@vaderito wrote:I agree with that. There's literally only one Remperortastic line in the movie and nothing else. That's still more than Rey and Poe romance set up that some podcasters (coughCollidercough) insist on. Laughing
@vaderito

Tbh, I'm a conspirator only pretending to be a Reylo. I'm really here for Emperor Poe and his Empress Rey. Please don't tell anyone.
@Darth Dingbat
I think everybody knows where I actually stand:



LOL. But for real, I'm a redemptionist all the way. I see Rey and Kylo's dynamic unfolding and becoming integral to the redemption arc, which is essentially why I'm here. I want to watch Kylo's delusions be completely shattered so he can overcome his past and become someone new, not all Ben or all Kylo.
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by vaderito on Sat 21 May - 18:03

Yeah, not all Ben or all Kylo is the way to go. They need a character who was on the other side and lived to tell what it's like to be both. If everyone was goody-goody or bady-bady, yuck, zzzzz.

BTW, Ruke >>>>>>>>> any variation of Rey and Poe (cause all smush names are ripe for mocking). His sideburns are just way too Sleazy Uncle. And he'll never live down that lip bite. Ruke makes more sense which is none at all. Laughing


Last edited by vaderito on Sat 21 May - 18:05; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sat 21 May - 18:04

@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:
@Darth Dingbat wrote:@SoloSideCousin: Richard was indeed a good example of how having guts can overcome serious physical shortcomings. Not only did he have severe scoliosis, but he was a short and by all accounts thin man who had a very delicate bone structure. Somehow this didn't stop him in battle, even against Kylo-sized opponents. The mindset required in Mediaeval warfare is something that's fascinating to me: in something as brutal as that, you need the ability to immerse yourself in a total battle trance. Once you snap out of that, you run for your life. That's how battles were lost...

@vaderito wrote:I agree with that. There's literally only one Remperortastic line in the movie and nothing else. That's still more than Rey and Poe romance set up that some podcasters (coughCollidercough) insist on. Laughing
@vaderito

Tbh, I'm a conspirator only pretending to be a Reylo. I'm really here for Emperor Poe and his Empress Rey. Please don't tell anyone.
@Darth Dingbat
I think everybody knows where I actually stand:



LOL. But for real, I'm a redemptionist all the way. I see Rey and Kylo's dynamic unfolding and becoming integral to the redemption arc, which is essentially why I'm here. I want to watch Kylo's delusions be completely shattered so he can overcome his past and become someone new, not all Ben or all Kylo.
@FrolickingFizzgig

Me too. Though after this discussion I actually have this little headcanon of Kylo as Richard III in space, except that Kylo is disappointingly tall for that.
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Darth Dingbat
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by CienaRee on Sat 21 May - 18:09

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
Kessel89 wrote:I am ultimately a redemptionist and that's where I see the story going, but I totally understand the appeal of Renperor because it would be interesting to see Kylo kill Snoke, take control of everything and become this awesome and powerful emperor, something Anakin could never do; not as a dark sider, but as a grey character. Also yes, Renperor is kind of hot. But I feel Star Wars would never do this.  If Kylo becomes the Renperor, I can't see him being allowed to "carry on." Reylo would not happen and he would remain a villian and be killed off.  

Anyway, everyone here saw this foreshadowing and potential between Rey and Kylo in TFA. We know how amazing this story can be based on their dynamic. At the end of the day, I just want a good story, but I really feel a good story involves Rey and Kylo developing their relationship, overcoming each other and ultimately finding themselves in each other. I don't even know what that will look like, but in Star Wars it can't happen with an unredeemed evil Kylo.
@Kessel89

I'm a total Redemptionist.  I'll say it here and now.  Kylo and where he goes is more important to me than where Rey goes or even Reylo.  I am all about redemption, and I think Kylo having a leadership position (let's not call it Renperor) during a transition or he becomes a leader on some backwoods world during exile in Episode X and beyond could be amazing.  I just hate the idea of him completely capitulating to the Resistance, because frankly, IMO, that side has its problems too.  Bad as he has acted, he could represent that Ransolm POV from Bloodline at some point, which is a legitimate viewpoint.  I want him to be Ronin or Rogue or his own guy.  Being a Jedi is not his own guy, neither is being Snoke's puppet.  He's not his mother in this absolute believer in the Rebellion/Resistance/Some vague vision of "the way the Republic should be" either.  Bloodline says he doesn't want to be a royal figure, even though he has the chance.  He is just such an interesting character with so many possibilities.  IMO his whole story should not be about just redemption or being worthy of Rey  ... I want him to be who he was supposed to be and was never allowed to be because Luke said his darkness was wrong, his mother sent him away when she couldn't figure him out, his father didn't know what to do with him, and Snoke abused him.  He has that unique force composition for a reason.  They hired one the best actors of his generation to play him.  I want them to do something with that.
@SoloSideCousin

I think even if he doesn't become Renperor the Galaxy needs someone capable of bringing peace and order to it after the chaos she's currently(with how corrupt the new Republic has become as shown by Bloodline I don't think it's as simple as having New Republic 3.0,the problems the previous one had would continue to exist untill someone finds a solution to it and I feel that both the FO and the Resistanse are not helping things by enaging into war with each other ) in so why can't Kylo and Rey be these people?It would be an interesting storyline and it would give a chance for Kylo to redeem himself.

CienaRee
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Re: Renperor and Reyempress Possibility Discussion

Post by BastilaBey on Sat 21 May - 18:10

I think the big problem at the moment is we don't really know what it is Kylo actually wants. We don't know why he joined the FO, although I'm guessing it's a mix of finding out he has darkside lineage, feeling abandoned and lied to by his family, and political dillusionment. He presumably saw Leia through his childhood struggling to get anything done in the Senate. He may have been appalled that the resistance was somehow considered the solution.

And I think his perceived incompetence in TFA isn't from a place of stupidity, it's inner turmoil that's force-related. If over the trilogy he learns to balance light and dark, and is at peace with himself, that's the biggest thing for me. But then he needs to decide what he's going to do with his life and so does Rey, and hopefully they'll have a shared goal. That could be about helping to set up a new system that's fairer, it doesn't have to be 'Renperor' but they both have a lot of potential and strength.
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