ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by IoJovi on Fri 17 Feb 2017, 8:01 pm

@Maria Antonietta wrote:Which one of you have that Rian Johnson quote about loving pathetic villains? I want to use it as cover pic for my Facebook page just to pi** haters off
@Maria Antonietta

I love your Facebook page. You're not shy about letting people know how you feel about this trilogy... Laughing

And then there's the part about launching pigs...
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Maria Antonietta on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 3:16 am

@IoJovi wrote:
@Maria Antonietta wrote:Which one of you have that Rian Johnson quote about loving pathetic villains? I want to use it as cover pic for my Facebook page just to pi** haters off
@Maria Antonietta

I love your Facebook page. You're not shy about letting people know how you feel about this trilogy... Laughing

And then there's the part about launching pigs...
@IoJovi

When you read:
-kylo Ren wasn't and will never be a jedi;
-redemption is a risky move for Disney;
-he will kill himself;
-he'll become a one dimensional villain with the Knights of Ren
I'm sorry but these people forgot how sw works and I'm calling them stupid.
What's the purpose of a one dimensional villain?! Is it a good thing in a kids' movie?!
Yes, they're stupid and lack of fantasy. "he'll die badly" well, thanks, Internet screenwriters, because you know how this trilogy will end *sarcastic applause*.

THEY DESERVE SOME PIG IN THE FACE cheers
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Mana on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 4:55 am

I can't believe the 'Save The Children squad' are actually suggesting that Kylo Ren kill himself.....ffs people THINK OF THE LITTLE GIRLS!!! how will their fragile, impressionable minds deal with that sort of violence and abuse?!?!?!
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Maria Antonietta on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 5:12 am

@Mana wrote:I can't believe the 'Save The Children squad' are actually suggesting that Kylo Ren kill himself.....ffs people THINK OF THE LITTLE GIRLS!!! how will their fragile, impressionable minds deal with that sort of violence and abuse?!?!?!
@Mana

Don't forget that jj lied in the commentary lol!
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 8:02 am

@Mana wrote:I can't believe the 'Save The Children squad' are actually suggesting that Kylo Ren kill himself.....ffs people THINK OF THE LITTLE GIRLS!!! how will their fragile, impressionable minds deal with that sort of violence and abuse?!?!?!
@Mana

This is something I find especially disgusting.

"Save the Children" squad, indeed. Experts tend to agree that even real suicides shouldn't be talked much about in the media, because they have a tendency to encourage more suicides. Younger people are especially vulnerable to commit copycat suicide.

It's not that the topic of suicide should never be covered in fiction, but I honestly can't think of a worse idea for something like Star Wars. I can only hope people aren't actually being serious when they suggest this.
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by MeadowofAshes on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 8:25 am

LFL and Disney are geared toward children and families. Suicide of a character at all, let alone a character who has been canonically preyed upon by a creepy old child predator since conception = yeah right.
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Kessel on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 12:09 pm

Which does to show these people aren't really about "save the children" or save anything really, other than saving their own selective, personal preferences. It's pretty clear they don't really care about "impressionable" minds.

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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Maria Antonietta on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 1:18 pm

I need that old French KK interview now Very Happy
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Guest on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 1:19 pm

@MeadowofAshes wrote:LFL and Disney are geared toward children and families. Suicide of a character at all, let alone a character who has been canonically preyed upon by a creepy old child predator since conception = yeah right.
@MeadowofAshes

Yes. Also, Anakin slaughtered a whole group of children and choked Padme to death in the worst point of his life. Kylo Ren showed remorse for killing Han, went to great lengths to keep Rey to himself while abducting her, and rather than push her off the cliff, he offered her a chance to join him. Granted, she kicked his a** spectacularly, but are these really the actions of someone unredeemable? If anything, showing Kylo Ren abscond from Snoke, the creepy child predator is an empowering ideal.

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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by snufkin on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 6:30 pm

Because Annie Leibowitz's photos came up, this is an interesting take from Lando himself back in 1980 about the difference between pure good guys and bad guys. Lando is the original grey character if there ever was one

Actually, the most enthusiastic of all the cast members seems to be newcomer Billy Dee Williams, who signed on for Empire as Lando Calrissian, a con artist and former sidekick of Solo's. Williams loves the character, whom he views as a "Burt Reynolds kind of charmer" who complements Han's hotheadedness.

"It's more than pure entertainment," he says of the whole enterprise over tea one rainy afternoon. "I see it from at least three levels: a philosophical level, a real level and a cartoon level – and they're all great.

"People will say, 'Why did you do Star Wars after doing all those other things? This doesn't seem to be important for you.' That's really what they're saying. But it is important, because it's part of my growth.

"The introduction of Lando is a good one," he says firmly. "I talked to George when Star Wars came out and I was very candid. I said, 'Look, there's Darth Vader, the dark, black fear, and there's Alec Guinness playing the white knight, Ben Obi-Wan Kenobi. Here we go again, perpetuating that same old stuff.'

"And now, by having Lando [who slowly becomes an ally of Leia's cause and vows to rescue Solo], we're gonna have to put aside the old point of view. Now, we're talking about symbols – darkness as averse to clarity. Black, white, red, we're all included in the human dilemma, and Darth is scarier this time, because now we learn he's human – he's not a mechanical monster."


All of this notwithstanding, a certain, more specific meeting of the minds with director Kershner helped cement Williams' decision to join the project.

"Kershner and I sat down at my house in California and we talked about Eastern philosophy," Williams says. "He's into Zen, and I've been into Zen since I was about twenty-six; now I'm forty. Kershner said, 'I wanna introduce some Zen here, because I don't want the kids to walk away just feeling that everything is shoot-'em-up, but that there's also a little something to think about here in terms of yourself and your surroundings.'

"And that's what Yoda, who's a Zen master, is saying: before you enter the temple, you have to live out all your desires – the body is the temple and it houses your better self, and your better self is your mind. And that is what this wonderful little character is talking about.

"Power is a very peculiar thing. It's like the ego. The ego's only there to keep you above water. Once we realize something good about ourselves, we have a tendency to abuse the gift. That's what this film series is about: truths and consequences. As my wife says, 'Bachi atari.' That's Japanese for 'What goes around comes around.'

"I tell my son Corey that the greatest teacher is the teacher who says, 'Don't follow me, follow yourself. Because within you there is that kingdom, that life, that force.'

"Boy," says Billy Dee, his face suddenly flushed with a diversity of emotions. "I guess I sure can't describe my concept of these films any better than that."
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by MeadowofAshes on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 8:52 pm

@RandomObserver And in fairy tales, which can be quite dark, big sins come with a hefty price tag, but sinners remain redeemable so long as they are penitent. I think Ben Solo will most assuredly have a hefty price to pay for his sins, just as Anakin did for his. I'd put big bucks on self-sacrifice on Rey's behalf, in fact. But love transforms, and just as Luke's love for his father results in Anakin's rebirth in spirit form Rey's love for Ben will result in his rebirth into the light (in some manner or other), which aptly conveys two themes classic to fairy tales and the mythic: "No matter how far into darkness you fall, you can always choose the light" and "love tranforms".

What eludes me is how anyone can think a message of "If you fall into darkness and feel guilty about it, just kill yourself" would in any way find its way into a family based film. Like, what?
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Guest on Sat 18 Feb 2017, 9:07 pm

@MeadowofAshes wrote:@RandomObserver And in fairy tales, which can be quite dark, big sins come with a hefty price tag, but sinners remain redeemable so long as they are penitent. I think Ben Solo will most assuredly have a hefty price to pay for his sins, just as Anakin did for his. I'd put big bucks on self-sacrifice on Rey's behalf, in fact. But love transforms, and just as Luke's love for his father results in Anakin's rebirth in spirit form Rey's love for Ben will result in his rebirth into the light (in some manner or other), which aptly conveys two themes classic to fairy tales and the mythic: "No matter how far into darkness you fall, you can always choose the light" and "love tranforms".

What eludes me is how anyone can think a message of "If you fall into darkness and feel guilty about it, just kill yourself" would in any way find its way into a family based film. Like, what?
@MeadowofAshes

Absolutely! Well said. And that's the beautiful thing about fairy tales; happily ever after is a subjective term. But from a storytelling perspective, putting Rey and Ben/Kylo Ren together with a transformative message would be very powerful. Given Carrie Fisher's comment about Rey being "very forgiving," leaks from their filming in Ireland, and all of the other signs that have which point to Reylo, I'm really encouraged this will actually happen. And if the writers pull it off, it could go down as one of the most epic love stories in the SW franchise. I love you

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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Xylo Ren on Sun 19 Feb 2017, 10:36 am

WE'RE OFFICIALLY IN THE 200'S


credit: tumblr starwarscount
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by MeadowofAshes on Sun 19 Feb 2017, 1:33 pm

@Xylo Ren Woot woot!
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Guest on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 12:38 am

Kessel89 wrote:Which does to show these people aren't really about "save the children" or save anything really, other than saving their own selective, personal preferences. It's pretty clear they don't really care about "impressionable" minds.
@Kessel89

You know, the hilarious thing about the "Save the children" squad is that they really, really underestimate children and believe they can't think for themselves and need to be protected from everything. Children aren't stupid - they can certainly tell the difference between reality and fiction. And nowhere do I see the evidence more than at work. Since Suicide Squad came out last year, Harley Quinn - while always one of the most beloved Batman characters since her introduction in the 90s cartoon - has skyrocketed in popularity even more with girls and women of all ages! I work in a costume shop and I can't tell you how many times I get asked by little girls if there are any Suicide Squad Harley Quinn costumes in and the delight on their faces when they see it. During Halloween, I was practically asked this question everyday by kids, parents or women and when we eventually got the costumes in they sold out like wildfire and they're still popular even now.

Now, when you really look into it, is Harley Quinn a good role model for little girls? Oh I definitely wouldn't say so! She's an insane liar, thief and even murderer in some incarnations and has kidnapped and harmed people. She's also insanely in love with the Joker and can't seem to pull herself out of a relationship with him, and he is horrible to her and uses her for his own personal use, despite loving her in "his own way". This is something that's present throughout ALL of the different Batman incarnations, even the 90s cartoon. And yet, people love Harley. Why? She's a unique characters in her own way. Harley is shown as a lovable and ditzy character, yet she has her own charm with the fact that she is also hilarious, smart in a lot of ways, flawed and vulnerable in a way, rebels in a fun and awesome way and she is also interesting without the Joker because of this which is why so many people - kids and adults alike - enjoy her as a character.

Yet, I don't see these parents falling over and clutching their pearls when their daughter asks to dress up as Harley Quinn and the reason is because they know it's fictional and they trust that their child does too. They just want their children to have fun and fiction allows people to enjoy things in real life they wouldn't.

So yes, you guys are 100% right. These "save the children" people don't care for them at all and their arguments about Rey being a bad role model for little girls and them becoming confused are completely unfounded and utter rubbish.

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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Pyro Nebula on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 4:10 am

Probably not the best location for this but I just thought it was amusing, especially the last question. Have a guess.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-02-20/can-you-guess-these-movies-based-on-bad-pitches/8277862?section=arts-culture



Hopefully, TLJ will set the record straight for the GA.

Cheers Smile

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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Piper Maru on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 4:22 am

"An interracial couple gets chased by a man with a burning cross"?

WOW, this is garbage.

I'm a woman of color, feminist, I'm an abuse survivor and I just hate when antis/overall media talk about Kylo Ren/Reylo with references of abuse/racism. Can't wait for TLJ. I hope Rian makes their relationship less vague so people can stop with all this bullsh*t.
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Saracene on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 4:51 am

@Piper Maru wrote:"An interracial couple gets chased by a man with a burning cross"?

WOW, this is garbage.

I'm a woman of color, feminist, I'm an abuse survivor and I just hate when antis/overall media talk about Kylo Ren/Reylo with references of abuse/racism. Can't wait for TLJ. I hope Rian makes their relationship less vague so people can stop with all this bullsh*t.
@Piper Maru

I think the idea was to come up with movie summaries that sound terrible and wrong. It's not meant to be serious.

I like the summary for Wizard of Oz:

Lost girl kills the first person she meets, then teams up with others to kill again.
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Piper Maru on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 5:00 am

@Saracene wrote:
@Piper Maru wrote:"An interracial couple gets chased by a man with a burning cross"?

WOW, this is garbage.

I'm a woman of color, feminist, I'm an abuse survivor and I just hate when antis/overall media talk about Kylo Ren/Reylo with references of abuse/racism. Can't wait for TLJ. I hope Rian makes their relationship less vague so people can stop with all this bullsh*t.
@Piper Maru

I think the idea was to come up with movie summaries that sound terrible and wrong. It's not meant to be serious.

I like the summary for Wizard of Oz:

Lost girl kills the first person she meets, then teams up with others to kill again.
@Saracene

Oh, I know. I just got annoyed because I've read similar things that were not meant to be ironic -- especially on tumblr -- and I'm soooo tired.
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Rogue Rey on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 6:52 am

AppleCrumble122 wrote:
Kessel89 wrote:Which does to show these people aren't really about "save the children" or save anything really, other than saving their own selective, personal preferences. It's pretty clear they don't really care about "impressionable" minds.
@Kessel89

You know, the hilarious thing about the "Save the children" squad is that they really, really underestimate children and believe they can't think for themselves and need to be protected from everything. Children aren't stupid - they can certainly tell the difference between reality and fiction. And nowhere do I see the evidence more than at work. Since Suicide Squad came out last year, Harley Quinn - while always one of the most beloved Batman characters since her introduction in the 90s cartoon - has skyrocketed in popularity even more with girls and women of all ages! I work in a costume shop and I can't tell you how many times I get asked by little girls if there are any Suicide Squad Harley Quinn costumes in and the delight on their faces when they see it. During Halloween, I was practically asked this question everyday by kids, parents or women and when we eventually got the costumes in they sold out like wildfire and they're still popular even now.

Now, when you really look into it, is Harley Quinn a good role model for little girls? Oh I definitely wouldn't say so! She's an insane liar, thief and even murderer in some incarnations and has kidnapped and harmed people. She's also insanely in love with the Joker and can't seem to pull herself out of a relationship with him, and he is horrible to her and uses her for his own personal use, despite loving her in "his own way". This is something that's present throughout ALL of the different Batman incarnations, even the 90s cartoon. And yet, people love Harley. Why? She's a unique characters in her own way. Harley is shown as a lovable and ditzy character, yet she has her own charm with the fact that she is also hilarious, smart in a lot of ways, flawed and vulnerable in a way, rebels in a fun and awesome way and she is also interesting without the Joker because of this which is why so many people - kids and adults alike - enjoy her as a character.

Yet, I don't see these parents falling over and clutching their pearls when their daughter asks to dress up as Harley Quinn and the reason is because they know it's fictional and they trust that their child does too. They just want their children to have fun and fiction allows people to enjoy things in real life they wouldn't.  

So yes, you guys are 100% right. These "save the children" people don't care for them at all and their arguments about Rey being a bad role model for little girls and them becoming confused are completely unfounded and utter rubbish.
@AppleCrumble122

I've seen a lot of women and girls dress up as Harley Quinn - even the 15 year old daughter of my company's accountant did for Halloween.

As for the 'save the children' Helen Lovejoy brigade:


or as my brother likes to call them 'social justice warriors' they aren't really acting on behalf of the best interests of young and impressionable minds - they're acting on behalf of their own.  Things they don't want to see.
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by snufkin on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 12:02 pm

If you're not familiar with Tor.com, add them to your bookmarks list. Some of the smartest writing about fantasy and scifi. And while the parallels are about sacrifice for a larger political/social cause, it also touches on it being deeply personal. Han's sacrifice was specifically for his child
Beyond Han and Chewie: Cassian Andor, Sacrifice, and Redemption

Given the events of act three of The Force Awakens and of A New Hope itself, a Han analogue was always going to be part of Rogue One. This is the universe of the Star Wars movies at their most lawless and fluid: the Empire closing its fist around the worlds of the Old Republic while scoundrels, thieves, and gangsters take what they can from This is ultimately where Cassian and Han truly stand on common ground: both outsiders with blood on their hands, choosing to fight the good fight because it’s a good fight and not because of some fading sense of duty or obligation. This is nowhere more evident than in his actions throughout the Scarif raid. Cassian, and K2, are both there as close protection, support, and backup for Jyn. She’s the one who steals the plans, the one who transmits them, and the one who ultimately completes the mission. Cassian and his delightful, external robotic id are ready to lay down their lives to protect her, to give her all-important mission a chance a success. It’s especially significant that Cassian is the one who stops Krennic, as well—the man who has given everything to a cause he believes will make him great is downed by the man who chooses to stand for a cause much greater than himself.the rapidly shrinking territory still left. That’s what makes Han’s journey through the original movie so compelling—he willingly and heroically sacrifices his own freedom and, potentially, his life, for something bigger than he is. Plus he looks awesome doing it.

This is ultimately where Cassian and Han truly stand on common ground: both outsiders with blood on their hands, choosing to fight the good fight because it’s a good fight and not because of some fading sense of duty or obligation. This is nowhere more evident than in his actions throughout the Scarif raid. Cassian, and K2, are both there as close protection, support, and backup for Jyn. She’s the one who steals the plans, the one who transmits them, and the one who ultimately completes the mission. Cassian and his delightful, external robotic id are ready to lay down their lives to protect her, to give her all-important mission a chance a success. It’s especially significant that Cassian is the one who stops Krennic, as well—the man who has given everything to a cause he believes will make him great is downed by the man who chooses to stand for a cause much greater than himself.
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by snufkin on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 12:09 pm

It's Pyro Nebula wrote:Probably not the best location for this but I just thought it was amusing, especially the last question. Have a guess.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-02-20/can-you-guess-these-movies-based-on-bad-pitches/8277862?section=arts-culture



Hopefully, TLJ will set the record straight for the GA.

Cheers :)
@Pyro Nebula

That's just...wow. I know that the person who wrote it meant to be a joke, but that's in really poor taste and lands with a dull thud. Or leave making jokes about the KKK to the Coen Brothers. And given the events of the past month here in the States, those sort of painful chapters in our history here are being revisted. So it's pretty hard to joke about that sort of thing in the present moment. Hope this doesn't come across as jumping on you because it not a criticism directed at you, just that's a topic in our current environment here is very raw and ugly.
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by SanghaRen on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 4:21 pm

@Pyro Nebula wrote:Probably not the best location for this but I just thought it was amusing, especially the last question. Have a guess.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-02-20/can-you-guess-these-movies-based-on-bad-pitches/8277862?section=arts-culture



Hopefully, TLJ will set the record straight for the GA.

Cheers Smile
@Pyro Nebula

I actually find all Star Wars ones funny. Ok, the TFA one is not exactly good taste and is more like a "oh my, tell me they didn't go there" joke that leaves everyone a bit uncomfortable. I am really bad, I got only one right, can you believe it? And it was ANH. I really don't know my classics and I actually have not seen all the movies. Had to laugh at the talking frog. And I like "A woman wakes up after her wedding day and goes to work." She went to work all right.
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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Guest on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 4:24 pm

@SanghaRen wrote:
@Pyro Nebula wrote:Probably not the best location for this but I just thought it was amusing, especially the last question. Have a guess.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-02-20/can-you-guess-these-movies-based-on-bad-pitches/8277862?section=arts-culture



Hopefully, TLJ will set the record straight for the GA.

Cheers Smile
@Pyro Nebula

I actually find all Star Wars ones funny. Ok, the TFA one is not exactly good taste and is more like a "oh my, tell me they didn't go there" joke that leaves everyone a bit uncomfortable. I am really bad, I got only one right, can you believe it? And it was ANH. I really don't know my classics and I actually have not seen all the movies. Had to laugh at the talking frog. And I like "A woman wakes up after her wedding day and goes to work." She went to work all right.
@SanghaRen

Lol I would say the ANH one was a little to obvious Wink. But OMG the ROTJ one! I'm crying! LMAO!!!

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Re: ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

Post by Maria Antonietta on Mon 20 Feb 2017, 6:03 pm

"If Skywalker returns, the new Jedi will rise" could be foreshadowing? What if they are really using Adam and Eve theme? The new couple of a new king of Jedi?
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