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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by SoloSideCousin on Thu 2 Jun - 5:29

@Slade wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@Sylvia Snow wrote:In my opinion, both Rey and Kylo have this "What just happened?" Faces, I don't know for sure but maybe during their duel they just too focus on one another and discarded the surrounding area even if it's collapsing. Some sort of "Finding the Force" within each other

Kylo's expressions


And this are Rey's expression




Their expression somewhat mirrors one another, disbelief, . In the second picture, Rey even shows genuine concern for Kylo, she even have the blue light illustrated half of her face, the same side of Kylo's scar
@Sylvia Snow

Has anyone analyzed that streak of hair across her face? Is that a mirror image to his scar? Like her dark moment was a scar on her soul or something?
@SoloSideCousin

I think its blood on her cheek too, not hair. Kylo's blood.
@Slade

I think you are right. When you look really close it has the same consistency as the blood on his face.
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Slade on Thu 2 Jun - 6:00

And because I'm a weirdo, I'm wondering if his blood got *in* her mouth as well as on her lip/chin. Did she taste his blood?  Oh myyyyy...

They've marked each other, with blood.
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Slade on Thu 2 Jun - 6:03

Oh yeah, someone upthread mentioned Rey's expression while she and Kylo were finding the force, or whatever, at that ravine. When she opens her eyes , she looks straight-up *aroused*, and I refuse to believe that it was accidental. She does not look like that anywhere else in the movie, and then suddenly, heavy-lidded bedroom eyes...
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Sylvia Snow on Thu 2 Jun - 6:16

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@Sylvia Snow wrote:@SoloSideCousin

Oh, that's interesting! On the first picture of Rey, her hair and the shadow cast by the blue light on her cheek bone form this arrow shape, that kind of looks like a "horizontal line" or more correctly like a "positive parabola" across her face, while Kylo is having a physical scar that is some what like a "diagonal line" or an "inverse hyperbolic tangent" scar across his face

Sorry I have to use those mathematics description but that is all I can think of right now Embarassed
@Sylvia Snow

For the math dim among us ... would those trajectories of those lines tell us anything ... or are they just too marred faces?

Also the blood on her face is huge. Not only has she spilt his blood or drawn blood ... with it being so close to her mouth ... could it also mean the taste of blood ... with maybe implications for guilt and/or the dark side?
@SoloSideCousin

No, I don't think the lines mean anything, it just me after spending too much times today studying math and the fact that those lines kind of divided their face to two equal sides Lolilol

I like your thinking, taste of blood can also symbolizes for innocence lost right?
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by SoloSideCousin on Thu 2 Jun - 6:49

@Slade wrote:Oh yeah, someone upthread mentioned Rey's expression while she and Kylo were finding the force, or whatever, at that ravine. When she opens her eyes , she looks straight-up *aroused*, and I refuse to believe that it was accidental. She does not look like that anywhere else in the movie, and then suddenly, heavy-lidded bedroom eyes...
@Slade

Exactly! And did you know that JJ Abrams filmed those close-up shots (@Gemini, our production expert calls them choker shots and says that they are used to convey serious intimacy in film) not long before the film was released ... in L.A.? He didn't film them on the general set in Pinewood. There is an article floating around where he says that he decided he needed more in that moment. I don't know if he really decided that late in the game or really knew it all along. All I know if that DR and AD were brought in later for those close-up shots ... and to me it looks like JJ left no detail unconsidered in those shots. :-)
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Slade on Thu 2 Jun - 6:55

Oh, absolutely! I think it's one of the most important scenes in the movie. I wonder if JJ made the decision to film this scene late to reduce the chances of any leaks/spoilers?
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by SoloSideCousin on Thu 2 Jun - 7:59

@Slade wrote:Oh, absolutely! I think it's one of the most important scenes in the movie. I wonder if JJ made the decision to film this scene late to reduce the chances of any leaks/spoilers?
@Slade

I thought the same thing. The sound stage in LA would be a lot more private that's for sure. :-)
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Saracene on Thu 2 Jun - 8:24

Rey's expression across the gulf is hard to read, but I think I'd go with "what the hell just happened". I very much doubt it's guilt or concern.
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Gemini on Thu 2 Jun - 13:15

@vaderito wrote:
@snufkin wrote:It's hard to tell, but a couple of people on here have thought that there's something by her chin which is either her hair or that it's his blood. And her eyes are open in complete shock like "What the Hell just happened?!" Also some guilt, because she started fighting with him in order to save Finn and now there're two injured men on the ground. So she has to make a choice. Also notice how she looks back when Finn is being carried by Chewie on the Falcon. She knows that she's leaving him behind, but there's probably not enough time to get him before things blow to Hell. So yes, very guilty.
@snufkin

Doubtful she was making a choice when ravine made Kylo completely cut off. She couldn't go to him even if she wanted and looking back = wanted to go to him.
@vaderito

Agreed

She was looking side to side for a way across. There's guilt in her face, shock at what she's done, desperation to get over to him and help him. She didn't want it to end that way that's for sure. She looks back when she gets to the ship which is confirmed as her looking back at him.

Her character is pegged as someone who has abandonment issues and I don't think she is comfortable
abandoning him.

What's more you see the beginning of anger on his face

This last look represents what's going to start next episode

Kylos rage and her change of feelings towards him/compassion
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Reynak on Thu 2 Jun - 16:07

I agree, I think she looks concerned, there's guit at having to leave him to his death there, wounded and abandoned. She is not the kind of person who would leave anyone like that if she had the choice. There is a very ambiguous scene in ASoIaF novels where a girl, Arya, leaves a man grievously wounded but refuses to off him as he pleads. She refuses to give him the gift or mercy although she hates him because he killed a friend of hers. By then she knows that he, the Hound, isn't a monster like she had thought. So she leaves him and doesn't kill him and goes away after saying he deserves suffering.

Rey also had the chance to deliver a final blow on Kylo and she didn't. Like Arya, Rey knows the wounded broken man is a killer but she is no longer sure he is a monster and deserves death. In fact she knows he is a sinner but not a monster. I think she would have helped him if she had been able to because she is not the kind of person who abandons anyone who is helpless, not even those who don't deserve help and I'm not sure she hasn't realised he deserves more pity than hatred after what she saw in him through the Force.

This scene is connected to the deleted scene where Rey is told Finn will be all right. She continues staring ahead after she is told the good news, and her expression is not relieved or happy. I think she is thinking of Kylo and wondering if he will also be OK. She looks concerned there too. She is worried about Kylo and this makes sense if she doesn't want to kill him in E Vlll.

In TFA novelization Rey hears a voice in her head telling her to kill Kylo and she stops at the edge of the DS and doesn't kill him. Then the ravine separates them. In E Vlll Luke tells her to kill Kylo and she doesn't want to. She has seen the real him somehow and in spite of his horrible actions she feels compassion for him.


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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Jakku on Thu 2 Jun - 23:27

That's not blood on her face - it's a strand of hair.  You can see it blowing quite clearly just after she's dealt the final blow to Kylo.

@gemini - I agree with you that Kylo has a look of anger, and the junior novelisation describes him as feeling contemptuous that she hasn't finished him off when she got the chance. I think you're right that this is setting up the start of the next film.
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Darth Dementor on Fri 3 Jun - 0:07

@Saracene wrote:Rey's expression across the gulf is hard to read, but I think I'd go with "what the hell just happened". I very much doubt it's guilt or concern.
@Saracene

I surmise it's all three; overwhelming confusion, mixed with remorse. The fact she looked back before boarding the MF is a very small but telling detail.

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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Search Your Feelings on Fri 3 Jun - 5:44

@Saracene wrote:Rey's expression across the gulf is hard to read, but I think I'd go with "what the hell just happened". I very much doubt it's guilt or concern.
@Saracene

Agree, I don't think it's concern, I think it's a "What just happened" look mixed in with the tptb showing it's the start of a personal thing between them (good or bad) and the characters realize it as well. Like a promise to the audience that this isn't over between them (whether it be revenge or something else).
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Kessel on Fri 3 Jun - 6:13

@Search Your Feelings wrote:
@Saracene wrote:Rey's expression across the gulf is hard to read, but I think I'd go with "what the hell just happened". I very much doubt it's guilt or concern.
@Saracene

Agree, I don't think it's concern, I think it's a "What just happened" look mixed in with the tptb showing it's the start of a personal thing between them (good or bad) and the characters realize it as well. Like a promise to the audience that this isn't over between them (whether it be revenge or something else).
@Search Your Feelings

This is exactly how I interpreted it too. Rey looks shocked with what just happened. The whole ending with them staring at each other over the chasm seems to emphasize they'll meet again; it's not over.
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Saracene on Fri 3 Jun - 9:11

@Darth Dementor wrote:
@Saracene wrote:Rey's expression across the gulf is hard to read, but I think I'd go with "what the hell just happened". I very much doubt it's guilt or concern.
@Saracene

I surmise it's all three; overwhelming confusion, mixed with remorse. The fact she looked back before boarding the MF is a very small but telling detail.
@Darth Dementor

I thought it was more like a "is anyone following us" reaction, rather than "I hope he's ok". I generally think that Rey's sympathy or concern for Kylo is not as advanced yet at the end of TFA as some interpretations here suggest. I also don't think, for instance, that her reaction shot during the bridge scene has anything to do with Kylo. I think she's simply worried about Han (we can argue about whether it's realistic for her to think of Han as a father she never had, but still, that's what Kylo pulled out of her mind, so it's canon). And for a moment there, it looks like this tense situation might actually work out ok, so Rey looks relieved.
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by BastilaBey on Fri 3 Jun - 9:41

@Saracene wrote:
@Darth Dementor wrote:
@Saracene wrote:Rey's expression across the gulf is hard to read, but I think I'd go with "what the hell just happened". I very much doubt it's guilt or concern.
@Saracene

I surmise it's all three; overwhelming confusion, mixed with remorse. The fact she looked back before boarding the MF is a very small but telling detail.
@Darth Dementor

I thought it was more like a "is anyone following us" reaction, rather than "I hope he's ok". I generally think that Rey's sympathy or concern for Kylo is not as advanced yet at the end of TFA as some interpretations here suggest. I also don't think, for instance, that her reaction shot during the bridge scene has anything to do with Kylo. I think she's simply worried about Han (we can argue about whether it's realistic for her to think of Han as a father she never had, but still, that's what Kylo pulled out of her mind, so it's canon). And for a moment there, it looks like this tense situation might actually work out ok, so Rey looks relieved.
@Saracene

I agree. As I've stated before, the expressions are ambiguous enough that people project their own perception of kylo onto rey's expression, whatever that may be. I think this may be intentional on the part of the actress and director, since we are supposed to be viewing the antagonist through the heroine. Rey does not yet feel compassion for Kylo, even if he does a little for her. She is afraid of him, and acting in the way she always has - to survive, to defend herself against someone she thinks of as 'a nightmare'. This is why it will come as a surprise when she grows to feel compassion for him and does not wish to kill him even if Luke tells her it's the only way.
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Airemyn on Sun 5 Jun - 21:27

I would say that this is a TFA discussion so I'm going to move this thread to the TFA forum.

As for my thoughts on the look, I would say that she's shocked by her own power and even slightly concerned for him. As to whether she is aware of the latter is another thing entirely.
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by ladyconsular on Tue 7 Jun - 12:59

I thought it looked like she was coming out of a trance. From the moment she summoned the Force to the moment someone whispered in her ear to kill him, she seemed to be a whole other person. When she returned to being Rey, she looked shocked, confused and did seem to want to for a slight moment consider Ren's safety. I don't think it was due to any feelings for him though they are there too. I personally think now that she knows who he is, she wanted to bring him home for Han and Leia's sake. Despite not being there for her request to Han, she heard enough and I feel that hug was not just them mourning Han, but her crying that she felt like she failed to do what Han was sent out to do.

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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by snufkin on Tue 7 Jun - 18:38

Speaking of facial expressions, this moment says so much of what's going on between them

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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by SoloSideCousin on Tue 7 Jun - 18:51

@snufkin wrote:Speaking of facial expressions, this moment says so much of what's going on between them

@snufkin

That is the most amazing gif ever. Considering the moment, (he was just smashing his wound), he has the most amazingly open and almost childlike expectancy look on his face, and she is worried about him, but she desperately does not want to be. OMG! They totally saw something huge in each other's minds. They look like they have known each other for years, and not five minutes. Da** you SW producers! You make us wait for mind-read answers! (Shakes fists in the air in a ridiculously silly manner). Laughing
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Slade on Tue 7 Jun - 18:59

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@snufkin wrote:Speaking of facial expressions, this moment says so much of what's going on between them

@snufkin

That is the most amazing gif ever. Considering the moment, (he was just smashing his wound), he has the most amazingly open and almost childlike expectancy look on his face, and she is worried about him, but she desperately does not want to be. OMG! They totally saw something huge in each other's minds. They look like they have known each other for years, and not five minutes. Da** you SW producers! You make us wait for mind-read answers! (Shakes fists in the air in a ridiculously silly manner). Laughing
@SoloSideCousin

Yes, he looks very vulnerable. Does she look concerned or disgusted? Or both? I read it as disgust and horror and thought she looked like she was gonna puke when she saw his blood hit the snow.
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by Slade on Tue 7 Jun - 19:01

He is so beautiful there.
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by snufkin on Tue 7 Jun - 19:03

@Slade wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@snufkin

That is the most amazing gif ever. Considering the moment, (he was just smashing his wound), he has the most amazingly open and almost childlike expectancy look on his face, and she is worried about him, but she desperately does not want to be.  OMG! They totally saw something huge in each other's minds.  They look like they have known each other for years, and not five minutes.  Da** you SW producers! You make us wait for mind-read answers! (Shakes fists in the air in a ridiculously silly manner). :lol:
@SoloSideCousin

Yes, he looks very vulnerable. Does she look concerned or disgusted? Or both? I read it as disgust and horror and thought she looked like she was gonna puke when she saw his blood hit the snow.
@Slade

I think it's both for her, disgust at his actions/wound beating and also concern because of what she saw in him/bleeding. Just look at her eyes and mouth. There's a very slight tremble in her lower lip, almost like she's going to start crying but also setting her jaw (making up her mind that she's giving him no quarter because of his actions). But her eyes are pure anger and judgement because of what she just saw him to do to Han. Meanwhile his eyes are almost like he's asking her "Please." (and meanwhile poor sweet Finn is standing there ignored, probably starting to get a clue that something weird has happened between his friend and the FO's scary super enforcer).
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by SoloSideCousin on Tue 7 Jun - 19:28

@snufkin wrote:
@Slade wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@snufkin

That is the most amazing gif ever. Considering the moment, (he was just smashing his wound), he has the most amazingly open and almost childlike expectancy look on his face, and she is worried about him, but she desperately does not want to be.  OMG! They totally saw something huge in each other's minds.  They look like they have known each other for years, and not five minutes.  Da** you SW producers! You make us wait for mind-read answers! (Shakes fists in the air in a ridiculously silly manner). Laughing
@SoloSideCousin

Yes, he looks very vulnerable. Does she look concerned or disgusted? Or both? I read it as disgust and horror and thought she looked like she was gonna puke when she saw his blood hit the snow.
@Slade

I think it's both for her, disgust at his actions/wound beating and also concern because of what she saw in him/bleeding. Just look at her eyes and mouth. There's a very slight tremble in her lower lip, almost like she's going to start crying but also setting her jaw (making up her mind that she's giving him no quarter because of his actions). But her eyes are pure anger and judgement because of what she just saw him to do to Han. Meanwhile his eyes are almost like he's asking her "Please." (and meanwhile poor sweet Finn is standing there ignored, probably starting to get a clue that something weird has happened between his friend and the FO's scary super enforcer).
@snufkin

I think it's both too. She "knows something" about him that makes her want to give him some sympathy, but in the end she's like "F*** that, he's a monster! And make sure you remember that!"
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Re: Rey's facial expression

Post by snufkin on Tue 7 Jun - 19:47

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@snufkin

I think it's both too.  She "knows something" about him that makes her want to give him some sympathy, but in the end she's like "F*** that, he's a monster! And make sure you remember that!"
@SoloSideCousin

It's a fine distinction, but she definitely has an insight into him from their first mental tug of war that helps her understand what he's capable of, both in terms of the best and worst of his actions. It's both moral disgust and also personal disgust, she is literally giving him no quarter for his actions. The lower lip tremble is so quick but you can see there how she's on the verge of crying but then sets her jaw. And it's sad/pathetic on his end, continuing to follow after her with that wound and pleading with that facial expres​sion(underneath the bravado of his words).
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