Kylo could become stronger than Vader

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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by Darth_Awakened on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 12:55

Why some of you think that Poe does not know who Kylo Ren really is?
I must admit I have not been thinking much of it - but somehow I thought that Poe was well aware of the fact Kylo was Ben Solo.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by IoJovi on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 12:56

@Darth_Awakened wrote:Why some of you think that Poe does not know who Kylo Ren really is?
I must admit I have not been thinking much of it - but somehow I thought that Poe was well aware of the fact Kylo was Ben Solo.
@Darth_Awakened

I actually this was semi-confirmed by Pablo. He stated most people in the Resistance did not know Kylo Ren was Han and Leia's son. Although Poe admired and had great respect for Leia, he hadn't known her that long, and certainly not long enough to know she had a wayward son.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 12:58

@IoJovi wrote:
@Darth_Awakened wrote:Why some of you think that Poe does not know who Kylo Ren really is?
I must admit I have not been thinking much of it - but somehow I thought that Poe was well aware of the fact Kylo was Ben Solo.
@Darth_Awakened

I actually this was semi-confirmed by Pablo. He stated most people in the Resistance did not know Kylo Ren was Han and Leia's son. Although Poe admired and had great respect for Leia, he hadn't known her that long, and certainly not long enough to know she had a wayward son.
@IoJovi

This. And I think that someone asked Pablo at one point if Poe and Kylo were childhood friends and/or knew each other as children, and Pablo confirmed that they did not.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by vaderito on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 13:32

Poe is completely irrelevant to Kylo character. The banter between them is likely just actors, who are really good friends in real life, improvising and making the scenes more enjoyable than on paper. Oscar said he improvised " who talks first?"

Poe is even more irrelevant to Rey since nobody bothered to introduce them. Means they'll be of no consequence to each other, likely no scenes together in VIII.

I get that people got caught up in expanded screen time hype but lets keep things in check:



He's half Finn's size and that's how it should be in the movies.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by snufkin on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 13:40

The Buzzfeed article from Kylo Ren's point of view refers to Poe as "Captain Handsome." If they had known each other as kids, you can bet Ben would've resented the Hell out Mr. Captain of the Football Team and Homecoming King getting praise from his mother.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by vaderito on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 13:44

@snufkin wrote:The Buzzfeed article from Kylo Ren's point of view refers to Poe as "Captain Handsome." If they had known each other as kids, you can bet Ben would've resented the Hell out Mr. Captain of the Football Team and Homecoming King getting praise from his mother.
@snufkin

Buzzfeed article is speculation with no base in reality. They think Poe's more important than he really is. I go by Celebration poster as far as importance go.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by snufkin on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 13:47

@vaderito  - oh I know that. Just that it's a pretty damn good joke dubbing him Captain Handsome from a certain somebody's point of view.


Last edited by snufkin on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 13:51; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by Helix on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 13:48

@vaderito wrote:Poe is completely irrelevant to Kylo character. The banter between them is likely just actors, who are really good friends in real life, improvising and making the scenes more enjoyable than on paper. Oscar said he improvised " who talks first?"

Poe is even more irrelevant to Rey since nobody bothered to introduce them. Means they'll be of no consequence to each other, likely no scenes together in VIII.

I get that people got caught up in expanded screen time hype but lets keep things in check:



He's half Finn's size and that's how it should be in the movies.
@vaderito

Half Finn's size? Does he have to walk on his knees now? Seems unfair. Sad

Really though, I don't feel like there's much for Poe to do? I mean there's the possible plot of him taking over the Resistance for Leia, but that's about it. I doubt he has some backstory with Ben/Kylo, I feel like we'd know already or would've seen hints of it in the film or novels.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by vaderito on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 13:54

@Helix There's no story for him cause he's a Mary Sue. Totally perfect wish-fulfillment character who always wins, is always the smartest, etc. he'll continue to be like that. of course that he's going to be the greatest leader of the Resistance ever. of course that Leia's going to retire cause he's doing such amazing job she couldn't possibly measure up. of course that he's going to blow up another SKB. heck, maybe he blew up Luke's hut! cause he's so perfect. Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by Helix on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 14:08

@vaderito wrote:@Helix There's no story for him cause he's a Mary Sue. Totally perfect wish-fulfillment character who always wins, is always the smartest, etc. he'll continue to be like that. of course that he's going to be the greatest leader of the Resistance ever. of course that Leia's going to retire cause he's doing such amazing job she couldn't possibly measure up. of course that he's going to blow up another SKB. heck, maybe he blew up Luke's hut! cause he's so perfect. Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep Sleep
@vaderito

... and you won't hear any complaints about him from the people who called Rey a Mary Sue. Laughing
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by vaderito on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 14:14

@Helix Exactly. No wonder Kylux clobbered Storm Pilot. You can't write readable fanfiction about a perfect, flawless character. Soone ror later, people realize he's a Mary Sue.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by Darth_Awakened on Fri 5 Aug 2016 - 22:43

Thanks.
I did not know about Pablo s tweet.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by IoJovi on Sat 6 Aug 2016 - 6:52

@snufkin wrote:The Buzzfeed article from Kylo Ren's point of view refers to Poe as "Captain Handsome." If they had known each other as kids, you can bet Ben would've resented the Hell out Mr. Captain of the Football Team and Homecoming King getting praise from his mother.
@snufkin

Is that the same one where Rey asks Kylo, "Take off that mask, you look like a hairdryer..."?

Because that was lol!
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by snufkin on Sat 6 Aug 2016 - 7:29

@IoJovi wrote:
@snufkin wrote:The Buzzfeed article from Kylo Ren's point of view refers to Poe as "Captain Handsome." If they had known each other as kids, you can bet Ben would've resented the Hell out Mr. Captain of the Football Team and Homecoming King getting praise from his mother.
@snufkin

Is that the same one where Rey asks Kylo, "Take off that mask, you look like a hairdryer..."?

Because that was :lol!:
@IoJovi

It is, when he reads her the lyrics to “‘I Killed the Little Boy I Used to Be’ – it’s about loneliness and isolation.”
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by Darth_Awakened on Tue 9 Aug 2016 - 13:32

Am I the only one who sees Kylo not as power hungry man as his grandfather was?

The word spiritualist used by Pablo led me to believe that his goals and agendas has nothing to do with "ruling the Galaxy".
When Rey faces Kylo with his deepest fear - I do not think that the notion of powerful as Darth Vader refered to Vader s ambition but more likely to his powers of the dark side of the force, more on spiritual level, less on using that power to rule everything.
It seems to me (given the info we got so far from TFA to various sources aside, including Pablo) that Kylo is more interested in some kind of spiritual perfection of the dark side.
Hopefully we ll get more of it in EP8 - it would be much more interesting to explore the spiritual side of the force not some dark side megalomania ambition to rule the Galaxy. That was the way of Siths, and Kylo is not the one.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Tue 9 Aug 2016 - 13:37

@Darth_Awakened wrote:Am I the only one who sees Kylo not as power hungry man as his grandfather was?

The word spiritualist used by Pablo led me to believe that his goals and agendas has nothing to do with "ruling the Galaxy".
When Rey faces Kylo with his deepest fear - I do not think that the notion of powerful as Darth Vader refered to Vader s ambition but more likely to his powers of the dark side of the force, more on spiritual level, less on using that power to rule everything.
It seems to me (given the info we got so far from TFA to various sources aside, including Pablo) that Kylo is more interested in some kind of spiritual perfection of the dark side.
Hopefully we ll get more of it in EP8 - it would be much more interesting to explore the spiritual side of the force not some dark side megalomania ambition to rule the Galaxy. That was the way of Siths, and Kylo is not the one.
@Darth_Awakened

The power hungry/"rule the galaxy" thing came from the TFA Visual Guide, which Pablo wrote. I agree, though, that from what we see onscreen in TFA, it doesn't really seem like Kylo is power-motivated. The spiritual thing does come across, though, IMO.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by vaderito on Tue 9 Aug 2016 - 13:58

@ISeeAnIsland wrote:
@Darth_Awakened wrote:Am I the only one who sees Kylo not as power hungry man as his grandfather was?

The word spiritualist used by Pablo led me to believe that his goals and agendas has nothing to do with "ruling the Galaxy".
When Rey faces Kylo with his deepest fear - I do not think that the notion of powerful as Darth Vader refered to Vader s ambition but more likely to his powers of the dark side of the force, more on spiritual level, less on using that power to rule everything.
It seems to me (given the info we got so far from TFA to various sources aside, including Pablo) that Kylo is more interested in some kind of spiritual perfection of the dark side.
Hopefully we ll get more of it in EP8 - it would be much more interesting to explore the spiritual side of the force not some dark side megalomania ambition to rule the Galaxy. That was the way of Siths, and Kylo is not the one.
@Darth_Awakened

The power hungry/"rule the galaxy" thing came from the TFA Visual Guide, which Pablo wrote. I agree, though, that from what we see onscreen in TFA, it doesn't really seem like Kylo is power-motivated. The spiritual thing does come across, though, IMO.
@ISeeAnIsland

Pablo also said than when movie contradicts the book, movie is canon. Before Awakening contradicts the movie quite a bit especially in Finn's case. So if Pablo's book contradict the movie, movie takes precedence.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by Darth_Awakened on Tue 9 Aug 2016 - 14:03

@ISeeAnIsland wrote:
@Darth_Awakened wrote:Am I the only one who sees Kylo not as power hungry man as his grandfather was?

The word spiritualist used by Pablo led me to believe that his goals and agendas has nothing to do with "ruling the Galaxy".
When Rey faces Kylo with his deepest fear - I do not think that the notion of powerful as Darth Vader refered to Vader s ambition but more likely to his powers of the dark side of the force, more on spiritual level, less on using that power to rule everything.
It seems to me (given the info we got so far from TFA to various sources aside, including Pablo) that Kylo is more interested in some kind of spiritual perfection of the dark side.
Hopefully we ll get more of it in EP8 - it would be much more interesting to explore the spiritual side of the force not some dark side megalomania ambition to rule the Galaxy. That was the way of Siths, and Kylo is not the one.
@Darth_Awakened

The power hungry/"rule the galaxy" thing came from the TFA Visual Guide, which Pablo wrote. I agree, though, that from what we see onscreen in TFA, it doesn't really seem like Kylo is power-motivated. The spiritual thing does come across, though, IMO.
@ISeeAnIsland

That s why I was wondering about it, because anything in TFA suggested the he has his own agenda motivated by craving for such sort of power. He is obviously devoted to FO, but unlike Vader he is not so eager to be involved in the acts of mass destruction (Hosnian Prime=
Is he entitled: yes definitely - however in some more personal way.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by vaderito on Tue 9 Aug 2016 - 14:10

Kylo will finish what Vader started? Really Kylo? Like you finished the mission to get the droid? Cute FS girl caught your eye and you forgot about the droid cause the girl was all you needed. Laughing  Oh, Kylo. Never change.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by Darth_Awakened on Tue 9 Aug 2016 - 14:14

@ISeeAnIsland wrote:
The power hungry/"rule the galaxy" thing came from the TFA Visual Guide, which Pablo wrote. I agree, though, that from what we see onscreen in TFA, it doesn't really seem like Kylo is power-motivated. The spiritual thing does come across, though, IMO.
@ISeeAnIsland

Is it this part of the Visual Guide?

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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by SanghaRen on Tue 9 Aug 2016 - 14:45

The Visual Dictionary is written in an exaggerated way. I actually hated it the first time I read it. Now I got used to it. It's not like they could give much away when it comes to Kylo so I would not use it as 100% true especially when it comes to character motivations. I do think though that Kylo is desperately trying to live up to Vader's legacy - whatever he thinks it is - and is working on convincing himself that he is better than the normal people but is pretty much failing at it. If he was really convinced deep down that he was here to rule the weaker beings, someone please explain to me why he spared the lives of expandable weaker beings like a stormtrooper and a deck officer.
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Re: Kylo could become stronger than Vader

Post by Kessel on Tue 9 Aug 2016 - 18:13

@SanghaRen wrote:The Visual Dictionary is written in an exaggerated way. I actually hated it the first time I read it. Now I got used to it. It's not like they could give much away when it comes to Kylo so I would not use it as 100% true especially when it comes to character motivations. I do think though that Kylo is desperately trying to live up to Vader's legacy - whatever he thinks it is - and is working on convincing himself that he is better than the normal people but is pretty much failing at it. If he was really convinced deep down that he was here to rule the weaker beings, someone please explain to me why he spared the lives of expandable weaker beings like a stormtrooper and a deck officer.
@SanghaRen

That was my impression of the VD too. The language is exaggerated somewhat and the info has a superficial feel to it, like it's trying to give a certain impression, but there's more below the surface (which Pablo obviously can't give away yet).
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