Discussion: Podcasts

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by vaderito on Thu 15 Jun - 18:35

At 27:47 or so Jason says that it's an important bad guy. He's still trying to get more details. At 28:36 he says I know it's a character and then a moment later that I just know it's a big, important bad guy. He doesn't believe it's DJ, doesn't seem right. He says but we'll have more on it pretty soon.
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by Mrs Ben Solo on Thu 15 Jun - 18:58

vaderito wrote:At 27:47 or so Jason says that it's an important bad guy. He's still trying to get more details. At 28:36 he says I know it's a character and then a moment later that I just know it's a big, important bad guy. He doesn't believe it's DJ, doesn't seem right. He says but we'll have more on it pretty soon.
@vaderito

Thanks for the info. Very interesting!
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Thu 15 Jun - 19:09

vaderito wrote:At 27:47 or so Jason says that it's an important bad guy. He's still trying to get more details. At 28:36 he says I know it's a character and then a moment later that I just know it's a big, important bad guy. He doesn't believe it's DJ, doesn't seem right. He says but we'll have more on it pretty soon.
@vaderito

Yeah, I've been scratching my head over who that might be. I mean, weren't most of the "baddies" introduced in TFA, outside of DJ and possibly Holdo (depending on how you define a "bad guy")? And from what Jason said, it didn't sound like it would necessarily be a throwaway character, like "Elite Praetorian Guard #3".

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by vaderito on Thu 15 Jun - 19:12

ISeeAnIsland wrote:  
Yeah, I've been scratching my head over who that might be. I mean, weren't most of the "baddies" introduced in TFA, outside of DJ and possibly Holdo (depending on how you define a "bad guy")?  And from what Jason said, it didn't sound like it would necessarily be a throwaway character, like "Elite Praetorian Guard #3".
@ISeeAnIsland

Definitely not a throwaway. "Big, important bad guy". I remember that he speculated in one of his old podcasts that influx of bad guys in TLJ may be for offsetting the loss of Kylo ( as in Dark Side loses him). But I'll keep my expectations low cause the reveal that romance won't be a central thing really dampened my enthusiasm for the movie.
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by ZioRen on Thu 15 Jun - 20:04

Introducing another big bad in TLJ seems...really weird, honestly. Especially since we already have so many new characters and Snoke is woefully underutilized and underdeveloped. I'm starting to worry about how packed this movie is.

I don't think the series needs someone to fill in for Kylo if he leaves the bad guy side, just to expand Snoke's role and the nature of his evil. Phasma and Hux and, apparently, Snoke's all-important guards who are plastered all over merchandise exist, after all.
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Thu 15 Jun - 20:46

ZioRen wrote:Introducing another big bad in TLJ seems...really weird, honestly. Especially since we already have so many new characters and Snoke is woefully underutilized and underdeveloped. I'm starting to worry about how packed this movie is.

I don't think the series needs someone to fill in for Kylo if he leaves the bad guy side, just to expand Snoke's role and the nature of his evil. Phasma and Hux and, apparently, Snoke's all-important guards who are plastered all over merchandise exist, after all.
@ZioRen

If Hux gets off'ed early on (as some of us have been suspecting happens), that would open up something for a military commander on the First Order side. Phasma is going to be on the ground and involved in the action.

Or depending on who those MiB that show up on Ahch-To are...if it's not the KoR or the Praetorian guards but an FO strike force or something, maybe it's the leader of that group.

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by Darth_Awakened on Thu 15 Jun - 21:08

I don't know why I have a strange feeling it would end as Executioner Stromtrooper of somebody of that level of importance.

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by Cowgirlsamurai on Thu 15 Jun - 21:11

How many bad guys does it take to fill in for Kylo?  Neutral So many new characters at this point, I'm starting to lose interest in them. I hope they don't take much screen time away from the main players, blah.
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by ZioRen on Thu 15 Jun - 21:19

Cowgirlsamurai wrote:How many bad guys does it take to fill in for Kylo?  Neutral So many new characters at this point, I'm starting to lose interest in them. I hope they don't take much screen time away from the main players, blah.
@Cowgirlsamurai

These are my thoughts. Rose and DJ and Holdo and Paige (who was really the out of left field one for me that still has me like, huh?) the Snoke guards that are everywhere and now another important bad guy? All while we still have so much to build up with Rey and Kylo if we want that relationship to go as we hope for. It all just seems like way too much.

Well, at least most of that seems to be packed into the Finn storyline. So I'm hoping it doesn't interfere too much with the Force plot and Kylo's arc. Not that I want Finn to get minimized in his own arc because the character has so much untapped potential, but I'll readily admit that Kylo is really who I'm watching for.
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by Kylo Men on Fri 16 Jun - 0:53

They don't have enough useless bad guys already?

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by Kylo Men on Fri 16 Jun - 0:58

If it's not DJ, then shouldn't we assume it's Rey?

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by SoloSideCousin on Fri 16 Jun - 5:11

I honestly have always kind of thought Laura Dern's character would be a kind of embedded villain. They need a strong actor to replace Kylo in the upfront villain role. Dern and BdT fit the bill. (Just because he doesn't think it's DJ doesn't mean he is right. Again, the interpretation skills there are not always 100%).


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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Fri 16 Jun - 5:18

SoloSideCousin wrote:I honestly have always kind of thought Laura Dean's character would be a kind of embedded villain. They need a strong actor to replace Kylo in the upfront villain role. Dern and BdT fit the bill. (Just because he doesn't think it's DO doesn't mean he is right. Again, the interpretation skills there are not always 100%).
@SoloSideCousin

Right... Again, unless it's a big letdown of some Praetorian guard or something, DJ or Holdo make the most sense, as far as new baddies go.

If Holdo is embedded by the FO, I can't see LF wanting to give that away outside of the movie. Regardless of what Jason says, DJ would make more sense in that he's supposed to be a "shady" character up front.

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by vaderito on Fri 16 Jun - 7:35

ZioRen wrote:
Cowgirlsamurai wrote:How many bad guys does it take to fill in for Kylo?  Neutral So many new characters at this point, I'm starting to lose interest in them. I hope they don't take much screen time away from the main players, blah.
@Cowgirlsamurai

These are my thoughts. Rose and DJ and Holdo and Paige (who was really the out of left field one for me that still has me like, huh?) the Snoke guards that are everywhere and now another important bad guy? All while we still have so much to build up with Rey and Kylo if we want that relationship to go as we hope for. It all just seems like way too much.

Well, at least most of that seems to be packed into the Finn storyline. So I'm hoping it doesn't interfere too much with the Force plot and Kylo's arc. Not that I want Finn to get minimized in his own arc because the character has so much untapped potential, but I'll readily admit that Kylo is really who I'm watching for.
@ZioRen

You are right that most of them are in Finn's storyline, but that's because he'll be the designated action man of the movie. So he (and Rose) will fight them at some points, which is OK for that storyline. After all, their plot is "James Bond" so to speak. They have DJ and chasers (Canto Bight) and then executioner troopers, Phasma and maybe Praetorians on Snoke's destroyer. Now, speaking of Praetorians, there are too many for just Finn and Rose so my guess is that there will be a finale on Star Destroyer where they can engage more characters. Doubtful that Rey and Luke will get straight to Snoke, if they go for Snoke and Kylo, without fighting some Praetorians first. Likewise, Kylo may engage too if he changes sides. Fighting just Rey once or twice doesn't really do it.

I also find it interesting that Adam never emphasizes Kylo's badassery in his interviews but humanity, deep wounds, that patricide isn't all that's made out to be,etc, which is very similar to what Daisy says about Rey's emotional injury, that meeting our heroes isn't all that's made out to be. So it looks like their arcs have some similarity again. OTOH, we have John and KMT emphasizing adventure in their story, so that's very balanced, IMO. And then there's political plot, so to speak, with power struggle between Holdo and Poe/Leia, with battle scenes on the side.
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by Lily Snape on Fri 16 Jun - 8:28

My ISeeAnIsland wrote:
SoloSideCousin wrote:I honestly have always kind of thought Laura Dean's character would be a kind of embedded villain. They need a strong actor to replace Kylo in the upfront villain role. Dern and BdT fit the bill. (Just because he doesn't think it's DO doesn't mean he is right. Again, the interpretation skills there are not always 100%).
@SoloSideCousin

Right...  Again, unless it's a big letdown of some Praetorian guard or something, DJ or Holdo make the most sense, as far as new baddies go.

If Holdo is embedded by the FO, I can't see LF wanting to give that away outside of the movie. Regardless of what Jason says, DJ would make more sense in that he's supposed to be a "shady" character up front.
@ISeeAnIsland

DJ is so stereotypically shady-- the pseudonym, the actor, the attire-- that I'm almost expecting him to be good at heart when all is said and done, whereas Holdo strikes me as the potential Saruman type-- you think she's on the side of the good guys, but it turns out she has gone over.  But the more bad guys we have, the more I believe that Hux and Phasma will have bad things happen to them and that Kylo will be redeemed.

Maybe with the rumors about Hux and Phasma, this might be some FO commander who rises up if they are injured or killed.  It certainly would fit the pattern of the OT.  I mean, the Grand Moff Tarkin only survived one episode, when you think about it, and Boba Fett showed up in ESB and was killed off at the start of RotJ.  Heck, Jabba only showed up at the start of RotJ in the original films before George Lucas put him retroactively into ANH.  He was mentioned, but we never saw him until RotJ, and he didn't last that long.  But all of those guys made a big impression.  Vader became human all of a sudden and was no longer the Big Bad when ESB ended, so Palpatine stepped into the limelight there, but there were memorable villains around them all through the series, one after the other.
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by Darth Dingbat on Fri 16 Jun - 16:56

If anybody needs a big, important bad guy, I've got this immortal Emperor I can introduce you to... rabbit

Seriously though, if the "Source of the Dark Side" plays into this trilogy at all (and isn't reserved for the next trilogy or something... or isn't just a throwaway thing Wendig came up with), I feel like Snoke is more likely to be in service of that evil rather than that evil himself.


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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by Helix on Fri 16 Jun - 17:23

Please be a SW Eldritch Horror, please be a SW Eldritch Horror. Laughing
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by vaderito on Fri 16 Jun - 17:42

Darth Dingbat wrote:If anybody needs a big, important bad guy, I've got this immortal Emperor I can introduce you to... rabbit

Seriously though, if the "Source of the Dark Side" plays into this trilogy at all (and isn't reserved for the next trilogy or something... or isn't just a throwaway think Wendig came up with), I feel like Snoke is more likely to be in service of that evil rather than that evil himself.
@Darth Dingbat

Snoke is pimping for the Source of the Dark Side. Twisted Evil
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Fri 16 Jun - 19:22

vaderito wrote:
Darth Dingbat wrote:If anybody needs a big, important bad guy, I've got this immortal Emperor I can introduce you to... rabbit

Seriously though, if the "Source of the Dark Side" plays into this trilogy at all (and isn't reserved for the next trilogy or something... or isn't just a throwaway think Wendig came up with), I feel like Snoke is more likely to be in service of that evil rather than that evil himself.
@Darth Dingbat

Snoke is pimping for the Source of the Dark Side. Twisted Evil
@vaderito

I was totally thinking this, too! With the gold robes, etc, Snoke totally sounds like a Dark Side Pimp. Evil

While there was nothing hinting at a Bigger Bad in TFA, I'm certainly not opposed to the idea, and it does seem like the groundwork for that might have been laid in the Aftermath trilogy.

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by vaderito on Fri 16 Jun - 19:30

We don't know whether this new baddie is above Snoke or not, though. I do believe that Aftermath and Thrawn hint at Unknown Regions as important for either this trilogy (maybe in IX?) or the next. ST will have to lay some groundwork for the future movies that aren't recycling of the past.
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by panki on Fri 16 Jun - 21:01

Darth Dingbat wrote:If anybody needs a big, important bad guy, I've got this immortal Emperor I can introduce you to... rabbit

Seriously though, if the "Source of the Dark Side" plays into this trilogy at all (and isn't reserved for the next trilogy or something... or isn't just a throwaway thing Wendig came up with), I feel like Snoke is more likely to be in service of that evil rather than that evil himself.
@Darth Dingbat

I'm a big fan of this theory....having a big bad like that potentially sets up several sequel movies....it would be interesting if Snoke was a bit like Mandalore the Ultimate, and was sent by this Vitiate like character.

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Sat 17 Jun - 1:16

panki wrote:
Darth Dingbat wrote:If anybody needs a big, important bad guy, I've got this immortal Emperor I can introduce you to... rabbit

Seriously though, if the "Source of the Dark Side" plays into this trilogy at all (and isn't reserved for the next trilogy or something... or isn't just a throwaway thing Wendig came up with), I feel like Snoke is more likely to be in service of that evil rather than that evil himself.
@Darth Dingbat

I'm a big fan of this theory....having a big bad like that potentially sets up several sequel movies....it would be interesting if Snoke was a bit like Mandalore the Ultimate, and was sent by this Vitiate like character.
@panki

If there's a bigger-level baddie out there, it would also make Rian's comments about "not getting into Snoke too much in TLJ" make a lot more sense. Snoke would be set up to be the Dark Side Pimp/middle man, so there really wouldn't be a huge need for character development there.

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by Rimfaxe96 on Sat 17 Jun - 1:22

Kylo Men wrote:They don't have enough useless bad guys already?
@Kylo Men

My thought exactly. It doesn't help that Phasma, the oh so fearsome alpha stormtrooper, ends up thrown into the garbage chute. I'd be surprised if she doesn't bite the dust because of how she betrayed the FO at gunpoint.
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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by panki on Sat 17 Jun - 1:30

Rimfaxe96 wrote:
Kylo Men wrote:They don't have enough useless bad guys already?
@Kylo Men

My thought exactly. It doesn't help that Phasma, the oh so fearsome alpha stormtrooper, ends up thrown into the garbage chute. I'd be surprised if she doesn't bite the dust because of how she betrayed the FO at gunpoint.
@Rimfaxe96

You bring up an interesting point...on one hand Hux and Phasma appear menacing but Phasma dropped SKB's shields with barely any protest and Hux abandoned his men the moment SKB was blowing up....I feel it is supposed to tell you something about the FO- that the facade is impressive but the core is hollow and weak.

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Re: Discussion: Podcasts

Post by Mrs Ben Solo on Sat 17 Jun - 1:48

panki wrote:
Rimfaxe96 wrote:
Kylo Men wrote:They don't have enough useless bad guys already?
@Kylo Men

My thought exactly. It doesn't help that Phasma, the oh so fearsome alpha stormtrooper, ends up thrown into the garbage chute. I'd be surprised if she doesn't bite the dust because of how she betrayed the FO at gunpoint.
@Rimfaxe96

You bring up an interesting point...on one hand Hux and Phasma appear menacing but Phasma dropped SKB's shields with barely any protest and Hux abandoned his men the moment SKB was blowing up....I feel it is supposed to tell you something about the FO- that the facade is impressive but the core is hollow and weak.
@panki

Excellent point, panki. The First Order have somehow managed to amass a formidable fighting force and Starkiller Base did take out the seat of Galactic Government power but Snoke, Kylo, Hux and Phasma leave a lot to be desired in terms of (strong and stable - to mock a recent UK Election slogan) leadership. I'm waiting for a Big Bad with some gravitas who isn't either halfhearted or primarily concerned with self-preservation. Maybe Snoke will step up to the plate and be that in Ep IX, I'm just not feeling the fearsome from him right now.
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