The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Camaro on Sat 14 Oct 2017, 6:23 pm

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:
WhatGirl wrote:
1. How did you react to TLJ trailer a few days ago?
2. How do you feel now that Reylo is getting near to coming true?
3. How do you think you will react in theater when we actually get Reylo intense moments?

I viewed the ending of the trailer differently than some others. I didn't see a confirmation of romance. I saw Kylo and Rey relating as two Force users who've found themselves each isolated due to their powers. I think there will be scenes of Kylo showing Rey the ways of the Force. They will likely become friends. After that Vanity Fair article, I'm not expecting anything beyond a platonic connection.
@WhatGirl

I pretty much felt the same. The potential for it to go into romantic territory is there but I don’t expect TLJ to venture down that path.
@Mrs Ben Solo

As much as I want it, I'm the same. I didn't necessary see a confirmation of a romance in that last scene, but the potential for one was tripled in my mind. You could say I saw it as laying the foundation for a credible romance in Episode IX. Right now, there is a massive rift between them (there was an even literal chasm between them in Starkiller base!), but now we know there for sure is more to Rey and Kylo than just antagonist and protagonist, that they're going to find out just how similar they really are, and how much one can't exist without the other. Them coming together is as inevitable as the path of the planets around the stars.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Cowgirlsamurai on Sat 14 Oct 2017, 7:09 pm

@Camaro wrote:
Mrs Ben Solo wrote:
WhatGirl wrote:
1. How did you react to TLJ trailer a few days ago?
2. How do you feel now that Reylo is getting near to coming true?
3. How do you think you will react in theater when we actually get Reylo intense moments?

I viewed the ending of the trailer differently than some others. I didn't see a confirmation of romance. I saw Kylo and Rey relating as two Force users who've found themselves each isolated due to their powers. I think there will be scenes of Kylo showing Rey the ways of the Force. They will likely become friends. After that Vanity Fair article, I'm not expecting anything beyond a platonic connection.
@WhatGirl

I pretty much felt the same. The potential for it to go into romantic territory is there but I don’t expect TLJ to venture down that path.
@Mrs Ben Solo

As much as I want it, I'm the same. I didn't necessary see a confirmation of a romance in that last scene, but the potential for one was tripled in my mind. You could say I saw it as laying the foundation for a credible romance in Episode IX. Right now, there is a massive rift between them (there was an even literal chasm between them in Starkiller base!), but now we know there for sure is more to Rey and Kylo than just antagonist and protagonist, that they're going to find out just how similar they really are, and how much one can't exist without the other. Them coming together is as inevitable as the path of the planets around the stars.
@Camaro

Same here. I saw the last part of the trailer as a sign of Kylo's redemption and possible team up with Rey. But the gesture and nervous look on his face make me think of a man who's been pining for someone and finally had the guts to make a move, which could hint at romance in the near future (episode 9!) Very Happy
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Guest on Sat 14 Oct 2017, 7:18 pm

@Cowgirlsamurai wrote:Same here. I saw the last part of the trailer as a sign of Kylo's redemption and possible team up with Rey. But the gesture and nervous look on his face make me think of a man who's been pining for someone and finally had the guts to make a move, which could hint at romance in the near future (episode 9!) Very Happy
@Cowgirlsamurai

I can see that, yeah. It reminded me a bit of those '80s coming of age movies in which the guy doesn't have the nerve to ask out his crush until the very end of the film, after they've been both through a lot together.

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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by DarthRen on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 12:30 am

@Kylo Men wrote:Some of you don't think it's a confirmation of romance? I mean, I get where you're coming from. But did you see the look on his face?

1. I pretty much assumed  there was no way that the trailer would show any Reylo hint, that it was all under wraps. Then the recent about face and suddenly talking a lot about Kylo led me to think there might be a hint. I just didn't expect something so direct. That floored me. I didn't watch the trailer until I had read about it for two days. Superstitious.

2. I don't necessarily see myself as a shipper in the way that others do. And I didn't go through the shipping wars. For me it's not as emotional. It's just the right way to take the story. So in that sense I'm pleased.  

3. I would hope no one would shout and let everyone around enjoy the movie.
@Kylo Men

1. It depends on interpretation of what people mean as a hint to Reylo. Romance, alliance or friendship? I think it imo pointed at Kylo teaching her about the force + combine that with Luke lack of willingness to train her or it hints at their uneasy alliance. Maybe even both but this is as far as TLJ can go. Kiss, hugs are a bit too much for this movie.

2. I don't see myself as a shipper either, even I'd probably preferred them together given who they are, how lonely they've been, subtext in their scenes. It just makes sense but if they come up alternative scenario, then good too. But I'd a bit dissapointed if it's not romantic.

If it's like only friendship like: Nice to meet you, friend. You who can read my deepest thought and fears - who can understand me better than anyone - who I have stronger connection than anyone - who shares the same fear of being abandoned - who helped me with understanding of the force and my abillities - who have the same journey etc.

After all of this, hard to imagine them as just a friends but hey maybe it can work and really good.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 1:23 am

I understand managing your expectations, I really do, but even before the trailer, to me the question was always that of telling a big and bold story.

So now that we know the "mysterious connection" isn't just a mysterious spiritual connection but also a shared, unique-to-them "RAW, UNTAMED POWER" between them, I personally see it as even less likely than I did before that the endgame could be anything other than a romance. (How it unfolds and how it ends is another matter.)

It's not simply about the pleasant surprise of Kylo holding out his hand in the trailer. In fact, it's not about the hand at all. If you're looking for a way to humanise and dramatise the abstract spiritual concept of two characters connected by something raw and untamed that is visually associated with fire and explosions and the colour of blood, I know my choice wouldn't be to have them set aside their differences and become BFFs through the Force.

Not if you want to tell a big and bold story. And let's face it, the story is already bold: turns out the lovely, pure heroine has in fact the villain's raw, untamed potential and all its attendant dangers inside her.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by shii405 on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 2:18 am

@Darth Dingbat wrote:I understand managing your expectations, I really do, but even before the trailer, to me the question was always that of telling a big and bold story.

So now that we know the "mysterious connection" isn't just a mysterious spiritual connection but also a shared, unique-to-them "RAW, UNTAMED POWER" between them, I personally see it as even less likely than I did before that the endgame could be anything other than a romance. (How it unfolds and how it ends is another matter.)

It's not simply about the pleasant surprise of Kylo holding out his hand in the trailer. In fact, it's not about the hand at all. If you're looking for a way to humanise and dramatise the abstract spiritual concept of two characters connected by something raw and untamed that is visually associated with fire and explosions and the colour of blood, I know my choice wouldn't be to have them set aside their differences and become BFFs through the Force.

Not if you want to tell a big and bold story. And let's face it, the story is already bold: turns out the lovely, pure heroine has in fact the villain's raw, untamed potential and all its attendant dangers inside her.
@Darth Dingbat

ITA with you. After they revealed this "raw power" thing, I am having trouble imagining Reylo would just stay platonic. It would still depend on how they solve the "how would you reconcile a patricide" question, but I still see a big potential for romance here, and I do not think Disney would let go this chance.

For those who dislike lovey dovey wishy washy romance, I say we have nothing to worry about. If they gonna go for that kind of romance, we'd already seen Reylo in romantic pose in the posters just like Han/Leia that time. I think they will be very careful with the romance plot.
And imho, the hardest and the struggle part should be in TLJ, and the process how they get there. Once they establish a bond, understanding, and trusting each other, their relationship would go steady and solid. There will be no doubting of betrayal or anything like that since they can read each other's mind anyway.
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Non-romantic implications of the trailer (merge)

Post by Moonjump05 on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 3:23 am

@shii405 wrote:
@Darth Dingbat wrote:I understand managing your expectations, I really do, but even before the trailer, to me the question was always that of telling a big and bold story.

So now that we know the "mysterious connection" isn't just a mysterious spiritual connection but also a shared, unique-to-them "RAW, UNTAMED POWER" between them, I personally see it as even less likely than I did before that the endgame could be anything other than a romance. (How it unfolds and how it ends is another matter.)

It's not simply about the pleasant surprise of Kylo holding out his hand in the trailer. In fact, it's not about the hand at all. If you're looking for a way to humanise and dramatise the abstract spiritual concept of two characters connected by something raw and untamed that is visually associated with fire and explosions and the colour of blood, I know my choice wouldn't be to have them set aside their differences and become BFFs through the Force.

Not if you want to tell a big and bold story. And let's face it, the story is already bold: turns out the lovely, pure heroine has in fact the villain's raw, untamed potential and all its attendant dangers inside her.
@Darth Dingbat

ITA with you. After they revealed this "raw power" thing, I am having trouble imagining Reylo would just stay platonic. It would still depend on how they solve the "how would you reconcile a patricide" question, but I still see a big potential for romance here, and I do not think Disney would let go this chance.

For those who dislike lovey dovey wishy washy romance, I say we have nothing to worry about. If they gonna go for that kind of romance, we'd already seen Reylo in romantic pose in the posters just like Han/Leia that time. I think they will be very careful with the romance plot.
And imho, the hardest and the struggle part should be in TLJ, and the process how they get there. Once they establish a bond, understanding, and trusting each other, their relationship would go steady and solid. There will be no doubting of betrayal or anything like that since they can read each other's mind anyway.
@shii405

Yeah, you don't have bridal carry and extended hand with no romance. Those are romantic tropes- a platonic endgame would look very different.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Darth Rowan on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 8:18 am

Mod note: we moved some posts from the Reylo shipper celebration thread to this thread. The staff here believe it's important for there to be a space in this forum for discussion of a potentially non-romantic connection between Rey and Kylo Ren in the ST,  both because romance is not a guarantee and because we understand that there is a lot of anxiety about this subject.

It is equally true that a non-romantic Reylo scenario is not considered desirable by the vast majority of Reylo shippers. We will make efforts to ensure that the conversation in this thread is not derailed by celebratory Reylo discourse that would undermine the concerns of the non-romance point of view. By the same token we ask that anyone who wishes to discuss non-romantic outcomes for Reylo abstains from doing so in the celebratory Reylo threads. If anyone has questions or wants to voice concerns please PM me or any of the other staff. We have seen several threads derailed today and would not like to see that continue here. Thanks!

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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by SanghaRen on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 9:44 am

For the record I have zero anxiety about Reylo becoming romantic or not so I am not managing expectations, but just waiting to see how things develop. I always saw a connection between Rey and Kylo that will deepen, but was never interested in defining it. Personally, if it leads to romance, I have doubts that there’ll be any kiss in TLJ. I don’t see any valid premise for it and am not even sure what it would bring to the story. But ok. The answer is close so there’s no point in debating.

Actually with the raw power background, my first natural reaction was to imagine that they could develop some feelings, but part ways in the end because they are too much alike and that likeness as much as it binds them also stands in the way of a stable relationship because it’s too “heavy” a bond. Is that still called a romance when 2 people deeply care for each other but never are together? I guess not. Or maybe.

@DarthRen

Bouncing off your post, I think there are nuances in-between friendship and romance. There are people who love each other but cannot be together for various reasons. They are not really friends, they are not romantically linked so what are they? To me they just are. I never quite understand why everything has to be labeled. Even in friendship, there’s always this labeling and ranking going on. I must be a strange beast because I don’t have a best friend. I have “just” friends. And sometimes I am closer with one than another at some specific time in my life. So I would find it very fascinating if this ended up with an open Reylo. Linked by their raw power finally tamed and free as a bird to do whatever they want *The End*
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 10:08 am

@SanghaRen wrote:For the record I have zero anxiety about Reylo becoming romantic or not so I am not managing expectations, but just waiting to see how things develop. I always saw a connection between Rey and Kylo that will deepen, but was never interested in defining it. Personally, if it leads to romance, I have doubts that there’ll be any kiss in TLJ. I don’t see any valid premise for it and am not even sure what it would bring to the story. But ok. The answer is close so there’s no point in debating.

Actually with the raw power background, my first natural reaction was to imagine that they could develop some feelings, but part ways in the end because they are too much alike and that likeness as much as it binds them also stands in the way of a stable relationship because it’s too “heavy” a bond. Is that still called a romance when 2 people deeply care for each other but never are together? I guess not. Or maybe.

@DarthRen

Bouncing off your post, I think there are nuances in-between friendship and romance. There are people who love each other but cannot be together for various reasons. They are not really friends, they are not romantically linked so what are they? To me they just are. I never quite understand why everything has to be labeled. Even in friendship, there’s always this labeling and ranking going on. I must be a strange beast because I don’t have a best friend. I have “just” friends. And sometimes I am closer with one than another at some specific time in my life. So I would find it very fascinating if this ended up with an open Reylo. Linked by their raw power finally tamed and free as a bird to do whatever they want *The End*
@SanghaRen

I think that definitely counts as a romance dynamic? Just not a happy one, of course. But a lot of romances in fiction have a tragic or bittersweet ending.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by EchoBase on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 10:08 am

@SanghaRen wrote:For the record I have zero anxiety about Reylo becoming romantic or not so I am not managing expectations, but just waiting to see how things develop. I always saw a connection between Rey and Kylo that will deepen, but was never interested in defining it. Personally, if it leads to romance, I have doubts that there’ll be any kiss in TLJ. I don’t see any valid premise for it and am not even sure what it would bring to the story. But ok. The answer is close so there’s no point in debating.

Actually with the raw power background, my first natural reaction was to imagine that they could develop some feelings, but part ways in the end because they are too much alike and that likeness as much as it binds them also stands in the way of a stable relationship because it’s too “heavy” a bond. Is that still called a romance when 2 people deeply care for each other but never are together? I guess not. Or maybe.

@DarthRen

Bouncing off your post, I think there are nuances in-between friendship and romance. There are people who love each other but cannot be together for various reasons. They are not really friends, they are not romantically linked so what are they? To me they just are. I never quite understand why everything has to be labeled. Even in friendship, there’s always this labeling and ranking going on. I must be a strange beast because I don’t have a best friend. I have “just” friends. And sometimes I am closer with one than another at some specific time in my life. So I would find it very fascinating if this ended up with an open Reylo. Linked by their raw power finally tamed and free as a bird to do whatever they want *The End*
@SanghaRen

I'll let others speak for me this time and second that 100 %. I hate categories in general and I don't like giving names. I'm not ruling out anything. I just find it fascinating to watch their development and enjoying the anticipation of what's to come. Since I'm a natural doubter and sceptic, I can't help lowering my expectation from time to time, that's why I was so blown by that trailer, though at the same time it's curious, because I wasn't surprised at all by the last scene, so maybe my subconscious wants to tell me something.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Darth_Awakened on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 11:08 am

@EchoBase wrote:
@SanghaRen wrote:For the record I have zero anxiety about Reylo becoming romantic or not so I am not managing expectations, but just waiting to see how things develop. I always saw a connection between Rey and Kylo that will deepen, but was never interested in defining it. Personally, if it leads to romance, I have doubts that there’ll be any kiss in TLJ. I don’t see any valid premise for it and am not even sure what it would bring to the story. But ok. The answer is close so there’s no point in debating.

Actually with the raw power background, my first natural reaction was to imagine that they could develop some feelings, but part ways in the end because they are too much alike and that likeness as much as it binds them also stands in the way of a stable relationship because it’s too “heavy” a bond. Is that still called a romance when 2 people deeply care for each other but never are together? I guess not. Or maybe.

@DarthRen

Bouncing off your post, I think there are nuances in-between friendship and romance. There are people who love each other but cannot be together for various reasons. They are not really friends, they are not romantically linked so what are they? To me they just are. I never quite understand why everything has to be labeled. Even in friendship, there’s always this labeling and ranking going on. I must be a strange beast because I don’t have a best friend. I have “just” friends. And sometimes I am closer with one than another at some specific time in my life. So I would find it very fascinating if this ended up with an open Reylo. Linked by their raw power finally tamed and free as a bird to do whatever they want *The End*
@SanghaRen

I'll let others speak for me this time and second that 100 %. I hate categories in general and I don't like giving names. I'm not ruling out anything. I just find it fascinating to watch their development and enjoying the anticipation of what's to come. Since I'm a natural doubter and sceptic, I can't help lowering my expectation from time to time, that's why I was so blown by that trailer, though at the same time it's curious, because I wasn't surprised at all by the last scene, so maybe my subconscious wants to tell me something.
@EchoBase

LOL while reading this. I must say I had a silghtly similar experience with the trailer.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by EchoBase on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 11:11 am

@Darth_Awakened wrote:
@EchoBase wrote:
@SanghaRen wrote:For the record I have zero anxiety about Reylo becoming romantic or not so I am not managing expectations, but just waiting to see how things develop. I always saw a connection between Rey and Kylo that will deepen, but was never interested in defining it. Personally, if it leads to romance, I have doubts that there’ll be any kiss in TLJ. I don’t see any valid premise for it and am not even sure what it would bring to the story. But ok. The answer is close so there’s no point in debating.

Actually with the raw power background, my first natural reaction was to imagine that they could develop some feelings, but part ways in the end because they are too much alike and that likeness as much as it binds them also stands in the way of a stable relationship because it’s too “heavy” a bond. Is that still called a romance when 2 people deeply care for each other but never are together? I guess not. Or maybe.

@DarthRen

Bouncing off your post, I think there are nuances in-between friendship and romance. There are people who love each other but cannot be together for various reasons. They are not really friends, they are not romantically linked so what are they? To me they just are. I never quite understand why everything has to be labeled. Even in friendship, there’s always this labeling and ranking going on. I must be a strange beast because I don’t have a best friend. I have “just” friends. And sometimes I am closer with one than another at some specific time in my life. So I would find it very fascinating if this ended up with an open Reylo. Linked by their raw power finally tamed and free as a bird to do whatever they want *The End*
@SanghaRen

I'll let others speak for me this time and second that 100 %. I hate categories in general and I don't like giving names. I'm not ruling out anything. I just find it fascinating to watch their development and enjoying the anticipation of what's to come. Since I'm a natural doubter and sceptic, I can't help lowering my expectation from time to time, that's why I was so blown by that trailer, though at the same time it's curious, because I wasn't surprised at all by the last scene, so maybe my subconscious wants to tell me something.
@EchoBase

LOL while reading this. I must say I had a silghtly similar experience with the trailer.
@Darth_Awakened

Right? Somehow I knew that they would show Kylo, after Rey said "i need someone...."
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by SanghaRen on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 11:22 am

@EchoBase wrote:
I'll let others speak for me this time and  second that 100 %. I hate categories in general and I don't like giving names. I'm not ruling out anything. I just find it fascinating to watch their development and enjoying the anticipation of what's to come. Since I'm a natural doubter and sceptic, I can't help lowering my expectation from time to time, that's why I was so blown by that trailer, though at the same time it's curious, because I wasn't surprised at all by the last scene, so maybe my subconscious wants to tell me something.
@EchoBase It’s your subconscious telling you that you considered all possibilities Smile It was also clear to me when she said that, that the next frame would show Kylo. I did not expect the hand reach but him, yes. That’s the way the trailer was built. It was built to get to this frame, switching from his power and struggles to hers. My lowering my expectation was on the treatment of the characters. I was fearing a disconnect between TFA and TLJ. But I am quite relaxed on the actual development of relationships between the various characters. As long as it feels organic, I’ll move with the flow.

I think there’s a lot to be said about the definition of romance. I see a lot of discussion on romance ending in making out and produce Skywalker babies. So basically along the line they have to consume their relationship. And then on the other side, there’s the platonic relationship defined as they’re buddies as in drinking space beer and discussing force tricks, I guess Very Happy It’s interesting to see how we need to define a relationship between a man and a woman who are close but not sleeping together. Here are the terms I found: romantic friendship, passionate friendship, platonic love, platonic romance. Some definitions include hugging, holding hands and some not. I personally feel that this type of relationship is the least explored in movies. Probably because in RL it’s one doomed to cave under social pressure. If one of the two has a stable partner, chances are that this partner will one day say “It’s him/her or me.” And even without a stable partner, chances are family and friends will go like “But you’re not together? What are you doing then?”  I am not judging in the first case because I don’t think I’d like to share a guy. For the second case, a friend of mine and her male friend really look like a couple, going to holiday together and all, but are not. Now they even live together. She gave up and says now they are together even if they’re not just so people stop asking about it.

In a Universe like SW that allows people to bond through the Force, I think the relationship between two force sensitive people is less bound to this defining need. It just makes sense that they have a special connection. Let’s just say that I can see some leeway here in defining Reylo and am looking forward to RJ’s view on it.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by snufkin on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 11:39 am

They'll just be Force buddies with benefits (j/k!). The ironic thing is that we're over here in our corner debating if it'll be romantic, platonic, spiritual, et cetera. Meanwhile, the chorus of people who've hated on this character for two years and continued to insist that Rey being this perfect pure vessel of the Gospel according to George Lucas who can only either murder or pity him are going to have a stroke over however they play out the Red String of Fate scenario. Even this topic alone, that she'd have *any* type of connection with him? Whatever Rian Johnson wrote is probably send that part of the audience members, though not the GA. screaming out of the theaters and back to their safe havens of less nuanced parts of the fictional universe . Or the other fantasy franchises they kept insisting were the model for how a hero and villain are 'supposed' to interact (editorial comments, some of theses fans seem to be on a literary diet of only books from the SW canon or written by JKR, GRM, or JRRT). I'd predict we'll at least hear a lot of shouting about how 'disappointed' they are in how Rey's character being compromised (and that continent seems to be willfully ignorant of the fact that none of us have ever wanted/expected for her to get stuck as being the LI or redemption vehicle for a bad guy) by this plotline and how disappointed they are in Rian Johnson. Or there will be 2 years of people insisting that Rey can break this bond and go back to being part of the Beautiful Friendship Gang while he'll die evvvuuulz or alone anyways. Bottom line, the very thing which we all spotted from the get-go and were excited out, romantic or spiritual/platonic, is what deeply unsettles and challenges the expectations of the fans who've been shouting as us about how we're wrong.


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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Guest on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 11:59 am

It isn’t about managing expectations for me, either. I can well see how romance could be the cards from the latest trailer, that’s not in dispute. I’m simply looking at what’s been said in relation to TLJ, I don’t want to get bogged down in Variety Fair romancegate but I did pay attention to the full quote from Rian.



This says to me that Rey and Kylo have a lot of ground to cover in TLJ from where they left off in TFA. It sounds like the movie is going to be packed full of characters and plot. We don’t yet know how long Rey and Kylo will spend together or what the context will be. The first step must surely for them to find common ground and recognise the similarities they share. Their raw power seems to make them both repellent to Luke and attractive to Snoke who, from his speech in the trailer, covets their “truly special” qualities. The potential for their connection to end in romance is obviously strong but there are still platonic possibilities IMO. Considering everything else that’s going on in the wider context of the movie i.e all the battles, and the more personal aspects such as Rey getting to grips with her Force abilities and Kylo dealing with grief and guilt from killing Han, it wouldn’t feel right to rush into kissing and such. Let them get to know and understand each other first.

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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by reylo1992 on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 1:49 pm

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:It isn’t about managing expectations for me, either. I can well see how romance could be the cards from the latest trailer, that’s not in dispute. I’m simply looking at what’s been said in relation to TLJ, I don’t want to get bogged down in Variety Fair romancegate but I did pay attention to the full quote from Rian.



This says to me that Rey and Kylo have a lot of ground to cover in TLJ from where they left off in TFA. It sounds like the movie is going to be packed full of characters and plot. We don’t yet know how long Rey and Kylo will spend together or what the context will be. The first step must surely for them to find common ground and recognise the similarities they share. Their raw power seems to make them both repellent to Luke and attractive to Snoke who, from his speech in the trailer, covets their “truly special” qualities. The potential for their connection to end in romance is obviously strong but there are still platonic possibilities IMO. Considering everything else that’s going on in the wider context of the movie i.e all the battles, and the more personal aspects such as Rey getting to grips with her Force abilities and Kylo dealing with grief and guilt from killing Han, it wouldn’t feel right to rush into kissing and such. Let them get to know and understand each other first.
@Mrs Ben Solo

What strikes me is the ambiguity behind the line "Well, you'll have to see". It implies that it won't end a la Anakin/Padme and Han/Leia with a kiss and a love declaration. So Kylo reaching out to Rey shall not lead to this if ambiguity shall remain?

Hard for me to imagine that Kylo and Rey would flee together too because it would make their love involvement too obvious IMO. And Kylo coming back to Mama with Rey by his side seems also out of option for the conclusion of the movie. So my feeling if that there ain't so many options.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Guest on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 2:10 pm

@Darth Rowan wrote:Mod note: we moved some posts from the Reylo shipper celebration thread to this thread. The staff here believe it's important for there to be a space in this forum for discussion of a potentially non-romantic connection between Rey and Kylo Ren in the ST,  both because romance is not a guarantee and because we understand that there is a lot of anxiety about this subject.
@Darth Rowan

I think anxiety probably belongs more in the fan fatigue thread than here (I realize there's been some crossover). This thread is really just a place to brainstorm different possibilities for Kylo and Rey to share a connection other than romance.

With that said, I think we've already been shown something like that in the trailer. Rey and Kylo do have something in common (raw, untamed power) that may be the root of their "mysterious connection" and it looks as though it'll unite them at some point in the film.

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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by rey09 on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 2:24 pm

Yeah I feel like I also have to temper my thoughts when I remember Rian's quote. I think it just comes down to semantics and how we define romance. Something powerful and intense is obviously happening between these two. Before they can really fall in love, they have to attain a level of care and empathy for the other. For me personally, that step I file under romance because it's part of the journey, but I can see why others would be wary to classify as romance from the get-go. See most people have no idea about the VF fiasco and when they saw the trailer they all thought "o s*** the reylos may be right." Reylo is about intense emotions and feelings, it's supposed to be something that transcends your typical romance. I think since they are a new kind of love story it is hard to really explain in words.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by DarthRen on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 2:35 pm

@rey09 wrote:Yeah I feel like I also have to temper my thoughts when I remember Rian's quote. I think it just comes down to semantics and how we define romance. Something powerful and intense is obviously happening between these two. Before they can really fall in love, they have to attain a level of care and empathy for the other. For me personally, that step I file under romance because it's part of the journey, but I can see why others would be wary to classify as romance from the get-go. See most people have no idea about the VF fiasco and when they saw the trailer they all thought "o s*** the reylos may be right." Reylo is about intense emotions and feelings, it's supposed to be something that transcends your typical romance. I think since they are a new kind of love story it is hard to really explain in words.
@rey09

I think you nail it especially there.

If we have Episode IX splitted into two parts or even just one movie, there is a room to explore it but to me TLJ will end with a possibility of it, but not really kiss or declaration of love. Something big is going on between them, truly hard to exactly define it in just few words, much more complex relationship. As JJ called it a very interesting relationship. So perhaps trying to call it just a romance, friendship, or platonic bond might truly not be accurate and bit simplistic. It could have all the elements but in the end it probably what really matters is the journey to discover themselves, full of feelings and intense moments is the essence of it.

It has a potential to be the most interesting, complex relationship we've ever seen in SW movies.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 2:40 pm

See, it's funny how everyone focuses on different parts of that quote. I tend to focus on "not the way it does in the original one", which - to me - implies there is some kind of romantic interaction but it's different. Which we always knew it would be, right?

And even if you don't believe in romantic Reylo, what about FinnRose? Would this really be a romance-free trilogy? And most importantly... why? It wouldn't have been that hard to write some kind of a romance into it.

But I agree, it comes down to semantics and of course biases and preferences like mine. I suppose we'll find out soon enough what Rian really meant.
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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Guest on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 3:07 pm

@reylo1992 wrote:
What strikes me is the ambiguity behind the line "Well, you'll have to see". It implies that it won't end a la Anakin/Padme and Han/Leia with a kiss and a love declaration. So Kylo reaching out to Rey shall not lead to this if ambiguity shall remain?

Hard for me to imagine that Kylo and Rey would flee together too because it would make their love involvement too obvious IMO. And Kylo coming back to Mama with Rey by his side seems also out of option for the conclusion of the movie. So my feeling if that there ain't so many options.
@reylo1992

The thing is Rey and Kylo are not like Han and Leia or Anakin and Padme. So although the middle part of the previous trilogies previously dealt with the central romance it isn’t possible in this case for numerous reasons, mostly the way Rey and Kylo left off in TFA and the fact there’s no time jump between 7&8. With Han and Leia, they were on the same side, even if Han’s commitment to the Rebellion wasn’t all that deep rooted. Plus they’d had 3-4 years between ANH and ESB to get to know each other better and for their attraction to build. Anakin and Padme were more impulsive and their love affair was conducted in secret, but they also started off on the same side and got to know each other under favourable circumstances. Rey and Kylo have to overcome a lot from TFA in TLJ to get anywhere near where Han and Leia and Anakin and Padme started off.

I’m not at all ignoring the soft romantic imagery of the reaching out trailer scene, but we know nothing of the context or where this fits into a possibly 2.5 hour movie. I do totally see Rey and Kylo coming to an understanding of each other and their Force abilities, I just think they won’t rush into anything like Anakin and Padme and it won’t be kept under wraps if/when they do. They have a mountain to climb to become allies with mutual trust, and it isn’t as if anyone around them is going to be cheering for them to become a couple. The idea of them being together romantically or otherwise will probably freak everyone out. I did think maybe Snoke would be into it to possibly get his hooks into more raw powered babies, but he surely wouldn’t want a couple with the power to overthrow him getting together. My prediction would be a platonic team up with UST simmering away possibly leading to romance in Ep IX when they’ve got the raw power figured out and Snoke and the First Order have been taken down. By that time, Rey and Kylo might not face so much opposition from the other characters or the GA, fans who don’t currently want Reylo to happen etc.

Or maybe it won’t be romance at all, ever. Maybe it’s heading towards something more like the Mortis Arc where Rey and Kylo are bound to keep the balance in a force/spiritual way rather than romantic/sexual. It doesn’t seem like it’s headed that way from the trailer, but until we know more the possibility remains.

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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Guest on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 3:21 pm

@Darth Dingbat wrote:See, it's funny how everyone focuses on different parts of that quote. I tend to focus on "not the way it does in the original one", which - to me - implies there is some kind of romantic interaction but it's different. Which we always knew it would be, right?

And even if you don't believe in romantic Reylo, what about FinnRose? Would this really be a romance-free trilogy? And most importantly... why? It wouldn't have been that hard to write some kind of a romance into it.

But I agree, it comes down to semantics and of course biases and preferences like mine. I suppose we'll find out soon enough what Rian really meant.
@Darth Dingbat

I don’t take any issue with that interpretation as I don’t believe romance has been ruled out, either.

Finn and Rose might have had the potential to be more like Han and Leia if they’d met in TFA. But even then, as there’s no time jump and TFA spanned mere days, they’d still be practically strangers even if they’re on the same side. As it is, it sounds like Rose starts off hero worshipping this ex-stormtrooper she’s heard about only to get that ideal knocked down when Finn doesn’t live up to it. Maybe they will then build a relationship on more equal terms, which looks like it will be the case. If so, they will no doubt have an easier path to romance than Rey and Kylo.

I’m not ruling out romance for Rey and Kylo in TLJ, and I certainly wouldn’t be against it as long as it feels like an organic progression. However, for reasons I’ve outlined in other posts, it might just take longer than the run time of TLJ with its packed plot lines and multiple characters to get there.

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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by Guest on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 3:30 pm

I feel pretty confident that there will be a time jump during TLJ. John Boyega mentioned a year passing in an interview which seemed to be an accidental slip, caught by @Darth Dingbat I believe. Bacta aside, Kylo's scar looks effectively faded in the shot when he reaches out to Rey; I'm thinking it's totally possible that a year or more has passed. By that point, they may have learned a lot about each other and communicated by visions, dreams, and exchanges of emotion. Rey doesn't understand Kylo, but perhaps in order to do that, she first needs to understand herself. She looks lost and confused in the trailer, in search of answers, and from the looks of it, she won't be getting them from Luke.

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Re: The Potentially Non-Romantic Connection Between Kylo Ren and Rey

Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Sun 15 Oct 2017, 3:37 pm


This is so good with the context of #rawpower. My favourite lightsaber battle. A+, JJ.
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