Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Acritiqua on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 9:11

I feel I must point out that Leia knew Kylo was possibly/probably on SKB. She sent Han with an "If you see our son, bring him home." But she wasn't going to not destroy SKB because Kylo might be on it and die in the explosion. She will do everything she can, but already her personal feelings haven't stopped her from endangering him.

Although I really suspect that Leia slaps Poe over Kylo. Did he accuse her of putting her evil son first?
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by vaderito on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 9:22

@Kylo Men

Jason explained in a podcast that "Luke goes for Snoke, Rey goes for Kylo" means they fight each, not that they go to different places. In fact, Crashing SD spoiler has Luke's sacrifice as one of things that happen at the end. So by the sound of it, people that find themselves on SD (which ever SD) are Rey, Luke, Kylo, Snoke, Finn, Poe and BB8. That also corroborates with Oscar's hint that he had scenes with Mark "near the end of the movie", which came after the Crashing SD spoiler.

The reason why I see something in this spoiler is because it doesn't fall into the fake leak pattern. It revealed some new things before MSW and marketing, the scenario is absolutely nothing like stuff that's theorized and speculated on the internet, it's cinematic af and also shocking but not in a crackpot way (Sloth Anakin, Reycanation). We'll see. I'll know if it's true or bogus because I know an additional detail that's make it or break it. If that checks than the whole thing checks. If not, well, it was a damn good scenario so the movie's one better be just as good or better.

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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by SoloSideCousin on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 9:24

Acritiqua wrote:I feel I must point out that Leia knew Kylo was possibly/probably on SKB. She sent Han with an "If you see our son, bring him home."  But she wasn't going to not destroy SKB because Kylo might be on it and die in the explosion. She will do everything she can, but already her personal feelings haven't stopped her from endangering him.

Although I really suspect that Leia slaps Poe over Kylo. Did he accuse her of putting her evil son first?
@Acritiqua

Right. That whole family situation is a lot more complicated than most of the audience gives it credit for. Han and Leia were ready, without hesitation, to kill their only son, because he was with the enemy.  Kylo actually hesitated and worried about killing Han, even though Han had just set a bunch of explosives in his son's immediate vicinity. Han actually hesitated about talking to his son, which would be an attempt at saving him from the bombs he had just set. Han actually maybe considered blowing up his son at the exact same moment that his son was rushing to get away from his father so he wouldn't have to hurt him. Leia doesn't even say "find him." She says "if you see our son." This is some hardcore dog-eat-dog sith. I think the only reason people don't see this because we're all so hardwired to believe in Han and Leia no matter what they do ... but if we had met them all at the same time, this would be insanely complex emotionally and morally, especially when you think of the instinctual parental bond to a child.


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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by vaderito on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 9:37

SoloSideCousin wrote:
Acritiqua wrote:I feel I must point out that Leia knew Kylo was possibly/probably on SKB. She sent Han with an "If you see our son, bring him home."  But she wasn't going to not destroy SKB because Kylo might be on it and die in the explosion. She will do everything she can, but already her personal feelings haven't stopped her from endangering him.

Although I really suspect that Leia slaps Poe over Kylo. Did he accuse her of putting her evil son first?
@Acritiqua

Right. That whole family situation is a lot more complicated than most of the audience gives it credit for. Han and Leia were ready, without hesitation,  to kill their only son, because he was with the enemy.  Kylo actually hesitated and worried about killing Han, even though Han had just a bunch of explosives in his immediate vicinity. Han actually hesitated about talking, which would be an attempt at saving him from the bombs he had just set. Han actually maybe considered blowing up his son at the exact same moment that his son was rushing to get away from his father so he wouldn't have to hurt him. Leia doesn't even say "find him." She says "if you see our son." This is some hardcore dog-eat-dog sith. I think the only reason people don't see this because we're all so hardwired to believe in Han and Leia no matter what they do ... but if we had met them all at the same time, this would be insanely complex emotionally and morally, especially when you think of the instinctual parental bond to a child.
@SoloSideCousin

Yes, that's some GoT-level familial complexity that SW has no time for cause it has to fill in the action quota. The Saga is supposed to be about the Skywalker family but it's also loaded with characters who are not the family so family stuff gets quite glossed over as a result. The dynamic between Han-Ben-Leia as described is much more interesting than rathars and Han baby-sitting Rey and Finn but the movie focused on that and only hinted at the dynamic above. Big loss, IMO.
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by motherofpearl1 on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 10:56

SoloSideCousin wrote:
Acritiqua wrote:I feel I must point out that Leia knew Kylo was possibly/probably on SKB. She sent Han with an "If you see our son, bring him home."  But she wasn't going to not destroy SKB because Kylo might be on it and die in the explosion. She will do everything she can, but already her personal feelings haven't stopped her from endangering him.

Although I really suspect that Leia slaps Poe over Kylo. Did he accuse her of putting her evil son first?
@Acritiqua

Right. That whole family situation is a lot more complicated than most of the audience gives it credit for. Han and Leia were ready, without hesitation, to kill their only son, because he was with the enemy.  Kylo actually hesitated and worried about killing Han, even though Han had just set a bunch of explosives in his son's immediate vicinity. Han actually hesitated about talking to his son, which would be an attempt at saving him from the bombs he had just set. Han actually maybe considered blowing up his son at the exact same moment that his son was rushing to get away from his father so he wouldn't have to hurt him. Leia doesn't even say "find him." She says "if you see our son." This is some hardcore dog-eat-dog sith. I think the only reason people don't see this because we're all so hardwired to believe in Han and Leia no matter what they do ... but if we had met them all at the same time, this would be insanely complex emotionally and morally, especially when you think of the instinctual parental bond to a child.
@SoloSideCousin

And.....this really bothered me as well.
At the end of the day, if Han and Leia were willing to sacrifice their child for the 'greater good'.....what else did they put before him? What really drove Ben Solo to become Kylo Ren?
Just what did he mean when he told Rey Han would have 'disappointed' her? And just what did Han want his son to forgive him for?
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Darth_Awakened on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 12:30

http://makingstarwars.net/2017/08/43094/

Maz apparently introduces the resistance to DJ. She helps the Resistance by pointing them toward a “mysterious new ally”. Maz has been forced to become more mobile and take more of a role in the criminal underworld.
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 13:17

Apropos of nothing, but I actually wonder if Justin Theroux is playing the role Joaquin Phoenix was rumoured to be pursued for. Could he be the "new villain" we'll see on FF?

I mean, Joaquin Phoenix was reportedly pursued for some role, and then it was assumed this role went to Benicio. But it just struck me that Joaquin and Justin are around the same height, the same age, and have a kind of similar look (IMO). Hmmm.

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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Darth_Awakened on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 13:26

Darth Dingbat wrote:Apropos of nothing, but I actually wonder if Justin Theroux is playing the role Joaquin Phoenix was rumoured to be pursued for. Could he be the "new villain" we'll see on FF?

I mean, Joaquin Phoenix was reportedly pursued for some role, and then it was assumed this role went to Benicio. But it just struck me that Joaquin and Justin are around the same height, the same age, and have a kind of similar look (IMO). Hmmm.

(YES, I'M JUST TRYING TO KEEP MY KING PRANA HEADCANON ALIVE, IS THAT SO WRONG, IS IT) Razz
@Darth Dingbat

You may be on something with it: especially regarding Phoenix and BDT looks. They're completely different types of man. Which could not mean anything, but you got the point.
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Mrs Ben Solo on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 14:07

Darth_Awakened wrote:
Darth Dingbat wrote:Apropos of nothing, but I actually wonder if Justin Theroux is playing the role Joaquin Phoenix was rumoured to be pursued for. Could he be the "new villain" we'll see on FF?

I mean, Joaquin Phoenix was reportedly pursued for some role, and then it was assumed this role went to Benicio. But it just struck me that Joaquin and Justin are around the same height, the same age, and have a kind of similar look (IMO). Hmmm.

(YES, I'M JUST TRYING TO KEEP MY KING PRANA HEADCANON ALIVE, IS THAT SO WRONG, IS IT) Razz
@Darth Dingbat

You may be on something with it: especially regarding Phoenix and BDT looks. They're completely different types of man. Which could not mean anything, but you got the point.
@Darth_Awakened

Didn't MSW say that Justin Theroux was in the Canto Bight Casino scenes wearing a sort-of inverse coloured James Bond tux? I guess he could be one of the rich assholes but I'm sure they described him as a croupier or maybe the slicer before they knew it was DJ.

Isn't Noah Segan supposed to be in TLJ too? I assume he's RJ's equivalent of JJ with Greg Grunberg.
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Darth_Awakened on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 14:31

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:
Darth_Awakened wrote:
Darth Dingbat wrote:Apropos of nothing, but I actually wonder if Justin Theroux is playing the role Joaquin Phoenix was rumoured to be pursued for. Could he be the "new villain" we'll see on FF?

I mean, Joaquin Phoenix was reportedly pursued for some role, and then it was assumed this role went to Benicio. But it just struck me that Joaquin and Justin are around the same height, the same age, and have a kind of similar look (IMO). Hmmm.

(YES, I'M JUST TRYING TO KEEP MY KING PRANA HEADCANON ALIVE, IS THAT SO WRONG, IS IT) Razz
@Darth Dingbat

You may be on something with it: especially regarding Phoenix and BDT looks. They're completely different types of man. Which could not mean anything, but you got the point.
@Darth_Awakened

Didn't MSW say that Justin Theroux was in the Canto Bight Casino scenes wearing a sort-of inverse coloured James Bond tux? I guess he could be one of the rich assholes but I'm sure they described him as a croupier or maybe the slicer before they knew it was DJ.

Isn't Noah Segan supposed to be in TLJ too? I assume he's RJ's equivalent of JJ with Greg Grunberg.
@Mrs Ben Solo

I think you're right about the Theroux costume. It was awhile when MSW posted it.
Also there's another mystery in Canto Baight, Rose and Finn definitely are in conflict with the guys in tuxedos. (because of speeder chase and the explosions) But we still don't knoe why. If it has some to do with the rumored prison break I would expect CB policemen involved in the chase not the tuxedo guys.
Just throwing some ideas here
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by vaderito on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 16:31

Darth_Awakened wrote:http://makingstarwars.net/2017/08/43094/

Maz apparently introduces the resistance to DJ. She helps the Resistance by pointing them toward a “mysterious new ally”. Maz has been forced to become more mobile and take more of a role in the criminal underworld.
@Darth_Awakened

Yeah, more Maz the Pirate Queen less Maz the Yoda Wannabe. I was hoping that her pirate fleet would appear in the battle but so far nothing.

Ok, so what or who are they looking at? They are not happy. It's on the Resistance ship, definitely pre-Crait cause of old hair, likely pre-infiltration too:



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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by IoJovi on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 16:37

vaderito wrote:
Darth_Awakened wrote:http://makingstarwars.net/2017/08/43094/

Maz apparently introduces the resistance to DJ. She helps the Resistance by pointing them toward a “mysterious new ally”. Maz has been forced to become more mobile and take more of a role in the criminal underworld.
@Darth_Awakened

Yeah, more Maz the Pirate Queen less Maz the Yoda Wannabe. I was hoping that her pirate fleet would appear in the battle but so far nothing.

Ok, so what or who are they looking at?  They are not happy. It's on the Resistance ship, definitely pre-Crait cause of old hair, likely pre-infiltration too:



@vaderito

I'm all for this too.  I remember an excerpt from Aftermath that really focused on Maz the pirate rather than Maz the advice columnist. It was fantastic!  I don't remember the exact details of it, but it revolved around how she basically keeps the peace in her establishment when the patrons many times are on opposite sides.  I know she has a smaller role in TLJ this time around, but I really hope her scenes focus on that aspect of her.

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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by vaderito on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 17:44

Most adorable Snoke Funko Pop doesn't have his Schwartz Ring prompting speculation that he may wear it at the specific point in the movie, not all the time. The crystal is hotly tipped to be the black kyber. Hmm, that would be interesting if the ring rules them all, I mena has some special powers or enhances Snoke's.
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Acritiqua on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 20:42

motherofpearl1 wrote:
SoloSideCousin wrote:
Acritiqua wrote:I feel I must point out that Leia knew Kylo was possibly/probably on SKB. She sent Han with an "If you see our son, bring him home."  But she wasn't going to not destroy SKB because Kylo might be on it and die in the explosion. She will do everything she can, but already her personal feelings haven't stopped her from endangering him.

Although I really suspect that Leia slaps Poe over Kylo. Did he accuse her of putting her evil son first?
@Acritiqua

Right. That whole family situation is a lot more complicated than most of the audience gives it credit for. Han and Leia were ready, without hesitation, to kill their only son, because he was with the enemy.  Kylo actually hesitated and worried about killing Han, even though Han had just set a bunch of explosives in his son's immediate vicinity. Han actually hesitated about talking to his son, which would be an attempt at saving him from the bombs he had just set. Han actually maybe considered blowing up his son at the exact same moment that his son was rushing to get away from his father so he wouldn't have to hurt him. Leia doesn't even say "find him." She says "if you see our son." This is some hardcore dog-eat-dog sith. I think the only reason people don't see this because we're all so hardwired to believe in Han and Leia no matter what they do ... but if we had met them all at the same time, this would be insanely complex emotionally and morally, especially when you think of the instinctual parental bond to a child.
@SoloSideCousin

And.....this really bothered me as well.
At the end of the day, if Han and Leia were willing to sacrifice their child for the 'greater good'.....what else did they put before him? What really drove Ben Solo to become Kylo Ren?
Just what did he mean when he told Rey Han would have 'disappointed' her? And just what did Han want his son to forgive him for?
@motherofpearl1 SKB destroyed Hosnian already (an entire planet, who knows how many people, not to mention all the animal and plant life). Now D'Qar is the next target (the whole system because Snoke doesn't even care which planet, he'll just destroy them all). They can't let SKB continue to exist. The cost is too great. If you have to choose billions of lives or your son what do you choose? I can't blame Leia and Han. Also they do not know if Kylo will survive or not. But his chances of surviving should be pretty good. He barely survived but that was because he just had to go after Rey and Finn with a severe injury that would have probably killed most people on the spot.

I know we're sympathetic to Kylo, but I think Leia and Han are giving him more consideration than he is them. Han is hesitating about going to Kylo because he doesn't truly believe he can reach him. Leia believes it, but Han is doubtful. I didn't think it was this cold thing where Han just wants to leave Kylo to die. There's also all his pain (you can hear it in his voice when he calls Ben). Kylo is kind of the opposite because he is hesitating on whether he will murder Han (not on whether he will risk himself trying to save him). When he does murder Han it is selfish. Han's act however was selfless.

And I say this believing that Kylo clearly loved Han still. He loved him and he hated him.

I expect however the backstory turns out, we will be able to understand the points of view of both Ben and his parents, and see the tragedy of what happened between them in a way where we can sympathize with all parties. I am sure of this because Leia and Han love Ben and Ben loved them.
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by SoloSideCousin on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 21:03

vaderito wrote:
Darth_Awakened wrote:http://makingstarwars.net/2017/08/43094/

Maz apparently introduces the resistance to DJ. She helps the Resistance by pointing them toward a “mysterious new ally”. Maz has been forced to become more mobile and take more of a role in the criminal underworld.
@Darth_Awakened

Yeah, more Maz the Pirate Queen less Maz the Yoda Wannabe. I was hoping that her pirate fleet would appear in the battle but so far nothing.

Ok, so what or who are they looking at? They are not happy. It's on the Resistance ship, definitely pre-Crait cause of old hair, likely pre-infiltration too:



@vaderito

Wouldn't it be wonderful if it was Rey saying, "Well you see, Kylo Ren is really not that bad. There is a lot you don't know. He's sitting on the Falcon. He can tell you everything." Very Happy

Of course, it won't be that, but it's fun to think about. Where did this picture come from? I haven't seen this one yet.
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Kylo Men on Sat 26 Aug 2017 - 21:49

Just what this story needs. More villains.

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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Darth Dingbat on Sun 27 Aug 2017 - 4:16

Darth_Awakened wrote:
Darth Dingbat wrote:Apropos of nothing, but I actually wonder if Justin Theroux is playing the role Joaquin Phoenix was rumoured to be pursued for. Could he be the "new villain" we'll see on FF?

I mean, Joaquin Phoenix was reportedly pursued for some role, and then it was assumed this role went to Benicio. But it just struck me that Joaquin and Justin are around the same height, the same age, and have a kind of similar look (IMO). Hmmm.

(YES, I'M JUST TRYING TO KEEP MY KING PRANA HEADCANON ALIVE, IS THAT SO WRONG, IS IT) Razz
@Darth Dingbat

You may be on something with it: especially regarding Phoenix and BDT looks. They're completely different types of man. Which could not mean anything, but you got the point.
@Darth_Awakened

*tries to compose a parentage collage with pictures of Justin and Daisy side by side, but runs into shirtless pictures of Justin Theroux and rapidly loses concentration*
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by WhatGirl on Sun 27 Aug 2017 - 4:50

Acritiqua wrote:I feel I must point out that Leia knew Kylo was possibly/probably on SKB. She sent Han with an "If you see our son, bring him home." But she wasn't going to not destroy SKB because Kylo might be on it and die in the explosion. She will do everything she can, but already her personal feelings haven't stopped her from endangering him.
@Acritiqua

Yeah. I've had to point this out before on another board because people were insisting that Leia isn't a reliable POV due to being a mother. Rolling Eyes

She went ahead and ordered the destruction of SKB despite knowing her son could still be on it. This isn't a character who's blinded by her maternal feelings. She tried to get him back but knew the risks, as did Han.

My theory is that both Leia and Ben have tried to spare the other in the war. I think he was the one to send the warning data card. Mother and son are fighting on opposite sides but, behind the scenes, try to avoid killing the other if possible.
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Cowgirlsamurai on Sun 27 Aug 2017 - 7:15

ISeeAnIsland wrote:
SanghaRen wrote:
Mrs Ben Solo wrote:Not sure what thread this belongs in but here's the first excerpt from Phasma... http://www.starwars.com/news/phasma-excerpt-first-order-captain-journey-begins
@Mrs Ben Solo

Maybe this one:

http://reylo.skyforum.net/t170-general-discussion-canon-novels-comics-short-stories

So Brendol Hux seemingly recruited her. I wonder if there's going to be some interactions with Hux Junior. There did not seem to be any animosity between the 2 in TFA but who knows. I can't remember, did they mention a timing for the novel? How old is Phasma? Is Parnassos a new planet in the canon? Is it in the UR? Is Rae Sloane still alive? Obviously, another question is whether we'll also hear about Kylo or is the whole book set before he joins the FO? So many questions...
@SanghaRen

Someone on another forum (I think it might have been someone either with connections to MSW or SWNN) made an off-hand comment about Phasma being one of the feral children in Empire's End. (I got the impression that he might have received an early copy of the book for review.) That could tie in with her being recruited by Brendol Hux.
@ISeeAnIsland

I'm finishing Empire's End now. This has got to be Phasma, right?

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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Sun 27 Aug 2017 - 8:33

Cowgirlsamurai wrote:
ISeeAnIsland wrote:
SanghaRen wrote:
Mrs Ben Solo wrote:Not sure what thread this belongs in but here's the first excerpt from Phasma... http://www.starwars.com/news/phasma-excerpt-first-order-captain-journey-begins
@Mrs Ben Solo

Maybe this one:

http://reylo.skyforum.net/t170-general-discussion-canon-novels-comics-short-stories

So Brendol Hux seemingly recruited her. I wonder if there's going to be some interactions with Hux Junior. There did not seem to be any animosity between the 2 in TFA but who knows. I can't remember, did they mention a timing for the novel? How old is Phasma? Is Parnassos a new planet in the canon? Is it in the UR? Is Rae Sloane still alive? Obviously, another question is whether we'll also hear about Kylo or is the whole book set before he joins the FO? So many questions...
@SanghaRen

Someone on another forum (I think it might have been someone either with connections to MSW or SWNN) made an off-hand comment about Phasma being one of the feral children in Empire's End. (I got the impression that he might have received an early copy of the book for review.) That could tie in with her being recruited by Brendol Hux.
@ISeeAnIsland

I'm finishing Empire's End now. This has got to be Phasma, right?

@Cowgirlsamurai

Ooh, nice catch!

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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Sun 27 Aug 2017 - 8:36

Sorry for the DP, but um...  new post from News From Jakku. So apparently, at some point, Rey sticks her hand on Snoke and sticks her pinkie finger into his robes??? (At least according to their source?)


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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by snufkin on Sun 27 Aug 2017 - 8:39

Ha, so the FO trio all sort of appear in that book. With Ben and Hux both out of the gate attracting attention/gossip because of who their respective parents are
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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Birdwoman on Sun 27 Aug 2017 - 8:53

So if Rey touches Smoke she becomes his apprentice now?

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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by IoJovi on Sun 27 Aug 2017 - 8:56

ISeeAnIsland wrote:Sorry for the DP, but um...  new post from News From Jakku. So apparently, at some point, Rey sticks her hand on Snoke and sticks her pinkie finger into his robes??? (At least according to their source?)

@ISeeAnIsland

My first reaction to this was to laugh out loud. lol!

I don't know what the context is here or what it could mean, but for some reason it's hilarious.

Lord help me...

It's probably the drawing with the pink background.

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Re: Discussion: Spoilers/Rumors

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Sun 27 Aug 2017 - 9:02

IoJovi wrote:
ISeeAnIsland wrote:Sorry for the DP, but um...  new post from News From Jakku. So apparently, at some point, Rey sticks her hand on Snoke and sticks her pinkie finger into his robes??? (At least according to their source?)

@ISeeAnIsland

My first reaction to this was to laugh out loud. lol!

I don't know what the context is here or what it could mean, but for some reason it's hilarious.

Lord help me...

It's probably the drawing with the pink background.
@IoJovi

I can't unsee Rey unsticking her finger apparently into Snoke, myself. Like, is he gelatinous or something?

In any case, Rey reaching up and touching Snoke seems really odd, given that we've got no context around this illustration.

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