What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by SoloSideCousin on Sat 7 May - 18:07

@Reynak wrote:"@thejediskywalker" , "@SoloSideCousin", I love you ideas in the posts above but there is a detail that doesn't add up, IMO.

"As for the map, ITA, Kylo doesn't want to kill Luke. He wants to find Luke. He needs something from Luke. Maybe it's to complete the mysterious "mission" from Vader and/or have a shot to escape. Rey's having the map in her head might be a gift he never expected. It would be a way that he could find the way to Luke without having the FO know."

He wants to find Luke and abducting Ray should give him access to the map, I agree, but bringing her to SKB is not the right move to keep the map away from Snoke's clutch. Everyone ( the ST, Hux, Snoke...) knows he has Ray and that the girl has seen the map. Kylo himself begs Snoke to help him get the map from her. If he doesn't Snoke to find Luke he made a poor job at keeping his location unknown.

Also, Kylo never gets the droid. We have often believed he doesn't care because Rey is too important for him to care about BB8, but what if he let him go on purpose so that the Resistance could find Luke? It has just occurred to me this is a possibility. I don't know why he let BB8 go when the Resistance could get him and the map. We don't really know what Kylo is about, not even what Snoke is about, because Snoke doesn't want the Resistance to get the map and seems more interested in preventing this than finding the map. Kylo, on the other hand wants the map and the girl but seems not to care if the map is found by the Resistance, perhaps he even wants them to find it.

Another thing, why did LST find the map at the time TFA takes place and not before? Perhaps because it's due time now for Luke's location to be known? Is Luke ready at last? Are LST's intentions clear and loyal or is he one of the friends that are thieves and traitors?
@Reynak

All excellent points.  I agree that bringing her to SKB could be a huge plothole in this theory.  The only possible way around it that I can think of at the moment is that if Kylo was the only one who got a good look then he could relay the information to the FO in such a way to keep them off the track.  However, I wonder how likely it would be for Snoke to just believe him and not want to read Rey's brain himself ... though he does seem impressed with Kylo's mind-reading abilities.  The whole "She resisted *you*!" bit.  Though that is certainly not a slam dunk for sure.  It's also possible that Kylo is playing some kind of very dangerous, hastily thought-out game in classic Skywalker and Solo fashion.  As such, he might go to Snoke because he literally needs Snoke's help to read Rey so he can screw Snoke.  A Solo might be nervy like that. :-) But I agree there are real issues here.

As for Kylo being okay with the Resistance finding the droid, I definitely think that's possible because I don't think he wants Luke dead.  There is even a little hint towards this in the script when Snoke decides to blow up the Resistance planet and Kylo is written as thinking "This is not what he wanted at all."  That tells me that Kylo had some kind of plan around this, and now it is literally blowing up in his face.  That's another reason he's so desperate to get back to Rey because (1) maybe it can stop Snoke from blowing up d'Qar, (2) Because he has connected with Rey, but also (3) Rey may be the only link to Luke if the droid blows up on D'Qar.
And that makes me think about Kylo's read and projection with Rey ... "So afraid to leave."  Kylo may need support to leave the FO or defeat the FO and probably only Luke can do that for him.

As for LST, I agree, that guy is just one big massive question.  He seems all wonderful, but I really hope he's not.  I want some grey thrown in that village thing.
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by SoloSideCousin on Sat 7 May - 18:10

@darkspellmaster wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:

I have not seen Winter Soldier. (I have a preschooler and that has seriously cut into my pop culture street cred over the past couple of years Laughing ) I know that @vaderito is a fan of that movie. What happens with the Winter Soldier that could apply to Kylo? It might be a while until I can see that movie, so I'm okay being spoiled, but please put any answer inside the spoiler box so others won't be spoiled.
@SoloSideCousin ]

Spoiler:
Bucky Barns was taken in by Hydra and brainwashed into becoming an assassin for them (In the comics it was Russia). Anyway after being freed by Cap and the others he's been trying to make up for his past crimes, by not only for a while taking over as Captain America, but also as a sort of mentor to the new Patriot character in the comics. What might apply is the fact that Bucky still remembers every kill that he did, and while he feels that he was brainwashed, he still wants to make amends for his actions and save the lives of people to make up for every kill that he committed.

In the new movie he outright lets himself be put back to sleep till he can get the brainwashing out of his mind. I'm wondering if Ben would need to do something like, or a mind wipe like Revan to get rid of the influence of Snoke.
@darkspellmaster

Okay, okay! Very interesting! Hmmm .... something to think over for sure. Thanks for getting back to me. :-)
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by vaderito on Sat 7 May - 18:13

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@darkspellmaster wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:

I have not seen Winter Soldier. (I have a preschooler and that has seriously cut into my pop culture street cred over the past couple of years Laughing ) I know that @vaderito is a fan of that movie. What happens with the Winter Soldier that could apply to Kylo? It might be a while until I can see that movie, so I'm okay being spoiled, but please put any answer inside the spoiler box so others won't be spoiled.
@SoloSideCousin ]

Spoiler:
Bucky Barns was taken in by Hydra and brainwashed into becoming an assassin for them (In the comics it was Russia). Anyway after being freed by Cap and the others he's been trying to make up for his past crimes, by not only for a while taking over as Captain America, but also as a sort of mentor to the new Patriot character in the comics. What might apply is the fact that Bucky still remembers every kill that he did, and while he feels that he was brainwashed, he still wants to make amends for his actions and save the lives of people to make up for every kill that he committed.

In the new movie he outright lets himself be put back to sleep till he can get the brainwashing out of his mind. I'm wondering if Ben would need to do something like, or a mind wipe like Revan to get rid of the influence of Snoke.
@darkspellmaster

Okay, okay! Very interesting! Hmmm .... something to think over for sure. Thanks for getting back to me. :-)
@SoloSideCousin

Most important thing about TWS:

Spoiler:
even though he wants to make amends, he's still programmed so when someone reads him trigger words, despite his resistance, programming takes over and he becomes a killing machine. One of several trigger words, aka Manchurian words (Tony Stark even makes a Manchurian Candidate joke), is Homecoming which is Easter Egg cause Spiderman:Homecoming. By anyway, point is that nobody will ever be safe from him cause of his programming that cnanot be undone. Always a risk of someone reading the words to him.
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by Rogue Rey on Sat 7 May - 18:17

@darkspellmaster wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:

I have not seen Winter Soldier. (I have a preschooler and that has seriously cut into my pop culture street cred over the past couple of years  Laughing ) I know that @vaderito is a fan of that movie.  What happens with the Winter Soldier that could apply to Kylo?  It might be a while until I can see that movie, so I'm okay being spoiled, but please put any answer inside the spoiler box so others won't be spoiled.
@SoloSideCousin ]

Spoiler:
Bucky Barns was taken in by Hydra and brainwashed into becoming an assassin for them (In the comics it was Russia). Anyway after being freed by Cap and the others he's been trying to make up for his past crimes, by not only for a while taking over as Captain America, but also as a sort of mentor to the new Patriot character in the comics. What might apply is the fact that Bucky still remembers every kill that he did, and while he feels that he was brainwashed, he still wants to make amends for his actions and save the lives of people to make up for every kill that he committed.

In the new movie he outright lets himself be put back to sleep till he can get the brainwashing out of his mind. I'm wondering if Ben would need to do something like, or a mind wipe like Revan to get rid of the influence of Snoke.
@darkspellmaster

I I love you The Winter Soldier - it's my favourite Marvel movie.

I can totally see something similar having happened to Kylo/Ben.

Darth Vader was under the control of a even more powerful FS user - he's practically the Emperor's lapdog and Kylo/Ben seems the same with Snoke.  

So I can see it being similar to The Winter Solider - it would certainly make for an interesting SL and some very powerful and emotional scenes for AD.
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by Rogue Rey on Sat 7 May - 18:20

@vaderito wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@darkspellmaster wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:

I have not seen Winter Soldier. (I have a preschooler and that has seriously cut into my pop culture street cred over the past couple of years Laughing ) I know that @vaderito is a fan of that movie. What happens with the Winter Soldier that could apply to Kylo? It might be a while until I can see that movie, so I'm okay being spoiled, but please put any answer inside the spoiler box so others won't be spoiled.
@SoloSideCousin ]

Spoiler:
Bucky Barns was taken in by Hydra and brainwashed into becoming an assassin for them (In the comics it was Russia). Anyway after being freed by Cap and the others he's been trying to make up for his past crimes, by not only for a while taking over as Captain America, but also as a sort of mentor to the new Patriot character in the comics. What might apply is the fact that Bucky still remembers every kill that he did, and while he feels that he was brainwashed, he still wants to make amends for his actions and save the lives of people to make up for every kill that he committed.

In the new movie he outright lets himself be put back to sleep till he can get the brainwashing out of his mind. I'm wondering if Ben would need to do something like, or a mind wipe like Revan to get rid of the influence of Snoke.
@darkspellmaster

Okay, okay! Very interesting! Hmmm .... something to think over for sure. Thanks for getting back to me. :-)
@SoloSideCousin

Most important thing about TWS:

Spoiler:
even though he wants to make amends, he's still programmed so when someone reads him trigger words, despite his resistance, programming takes over and he becomes a killing machine. One of several trigger words, aka Manchurian words (Tony Stark even makes a Manchurian Candidate joke), is Homecoming which is Easter Egg cause Spiderman:Homecoming. By anyway, point is that nobody will ever be safe from him cause of his programming that cnanot be undone. Always a risk of someone reading the words to him.
@vaderito

Spoiler:
that scene when Zemmo was reading the words to him nearly made me Sad you could see him fighting it and his heartbreak at knowing his effort was pointless it was tragic and then the freeze to protect the world from him was Sad too
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by vaderito on Sat 7 May - 18:23

@Rogue Rey I know, right? I love Bucky and that moment was so sad.
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by SoloSideCousin on Sat 7 May - 19:20

@vaderito wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@darkspellmaster wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:

I have not seen Winter Soldier. (I have a preschooler and that has seriously cut into my pop culture street cred over the past couple of years Laughing ) I know that @vaderito is a fan of that movie. What happens with the Winter Soldier that could apply to Kylo? It might be a while until I can see that movie, so I'm okay being spoiled, but please put any answer inside the spoiler box so others won't be spoiled.
@SoloSideCousin ]

Spoiler:
Bucky Barns was taken in by Hydra and brainwashed into becoming an assassin for them (In the comics it was Russia). Anyway after being freed by Cap and the others he's been trying to make up for his past crimes, by not only for a while taking over as Captain America, but also as a sort of mentor to the new Patriot character in the comics. What might apply is the fact that Bucky still remembers every kill that he did, and while he feels that he was brainwashed, he still wants to make amends for his actions and save the lives of people to make up for every kill that he committed.

In the new movie he outright lets himself be put back to sleep till he can get the brainwashing out of his mind. I'm wondering if Ben would need to do something like, or a mind wipe like Revan to get rid of the influence of Snoke.
@darkspellmaster

Okay, okay! Very interesting! Hmmm .... something to think over for sure. Thanks for getting back to me. :-)
@SoloSideCousin

Most important thing about TWS:

Spoiler:
even though he wants to make amends, he's still programmed so when someone reads him trigger words, despite his resistance, programming takes over and he becomes a killing machine. One of several trigger words, aka Manchurian words (Tony Stark even makes a Manchurian Candidate joke), is Homecoming which is Easter Egg cause Spiderman:Homecoming. By anyway, point is that nobody will ever be safe from him cause of his programming that cnanot be undone. Always a risk of someone reading the words to him.
@vaderito

Spoiler:
That is incredibly sad! OMG! I hope Kylo is not as doomed to his programming as all that. I want him to be able to break it.
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by vaderito on Sat 7 May - 19:25

Different kind of story but Bucky will probably be able to do that as well in upcoming movies.
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by panki on Sat 7 May - 20:00

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@vaderito wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@darkspellmaster wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:

I have not seen Winter Soldier. (I have a preschooler and that has seriously cut into my pop culture street cred over the past couple of years Laughing ) I know that @vaderito is a fan of that movie. What happens with the Winter Soldier that could apply to Kylo? It might be a while until I can see that movie, so I'm okay being spoiled, but please put any answer inside the spoiler box so others won't be spoiled.
@SoloSideCousin ]

Spoiler:
Bucky Barns was taken in by Hydra and brainwashed into becoming an assassin for them (In the comics it was Russia). Anyway after being freed by Cap and the others he's been trying to make up for his past crimes, by not only for a while taking over as Captain America, but also as a sort of mentor to the new Patriot character in the comics. What might apply is the fact that Bucky still remembers every kill that he did, and while he feels that he was brainwashed, he still wants to make amends for his actions and save the lives of people to make up for every kill that he committed.

In the new movie he outright lets himself be put back to sleep till he can get the brainwashing out of his mind. I'm wondering if Ben would need to do something like, or a mind wipe like Revan to get rid of the influence of Snoke.
@darkspellmaster

Okay, okay! Very interesting! Hmmm .... something to think over for sure. Thanks for getting back to me. :-)
@SoloSideCousin

Most important thing about TWS:

Spoiler:
even though he wants to make amends, he's still programmed so when someone reads him trigger words, despite his resistance, programming takes over and he becomes a killing machine. One of several trigger words, aka Manchurian words (Tony Stark even makes a Manchurian Candidate joke), is Homecoming which is Easter Egg cause Spiderman:Homecoming. By anyway, point is that nobody will ever be safe from him cause of his programming that cnanot be undone. Always a risk of someone reading the words to him.
@vaderito

Spoiler:
That is incredibly sad! OMG! I hope Kylo is not as doomed to his programming as all that. I want him to be able to break it.
@SoloSideCousin

I remember the EU has this concept of the child of the Emperor...where the sith Emperor would transfer some of himself into children from different parts of the galaxy so he could control them...the only remedy was to become immersed completely in the light side of the force....maybe something like that will happen to Kylo and Snoke will lose his hold on him?

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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by SoloSideCousin on Sat 7 May - 20:02

@panki wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@vaderito wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@darkspellmaster wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:

I have not seen Winter Soldier. (I have a preschooler and that has seriously cut into my pop culture street cred over the past couple of years Laughing ) I know that @vaderito is a fan of that movie. What happens with the Winter Soldier that could apply to Kylo? It might be a while until I can see that movie, so I'm okay being spoiled, but please put any answer inside the spoiler box so others won't be spoiled.
@SoloSideCousin ]

Spoiler:
Bucky Barns was taken in by Hydra and brainwashed into becoming an assassin for them (In the comics it was Russia). Anyway after being freed by Cap and the others he's been trying to make up for his past crimes, by not only for a while taking over as Captain America, but also as a sort of mentor to the new Patriot character in the comics. What might apply is the fact that Bucky still remembers every kill that he did, and while he feels that he was brainwashed, he still wants to make amends for his actions and save the lives of people to make up for every kill that he committed.

In the new movie he outright lets himself be put back to sleep till he can get the brainwashing out of his mind. I'm wondering if Ben would need to do something like, or a mind wipe like Revan to get rid of the influence of Snoke.
@darkspellmaster

Okay, okay! Very interesting! Hmmm .... something to think over for sure. Thanks for getting back to me. :-)
@SoloSideCousin

Most important thing about TWS:

Spoiler:
even though he wants to make amends, he's still programmed so when someone reads him trigger words, despite his resistance, programming takes over and he becomes a killing machine. One of several trigger words, aka Manchurian words (Tony Stark even makes a Manchurian Candidate joke), is Homecoming which is Easter Egg cause Spiderman:Homecoming. By anyway, point is that nobody will ever be safe from him cause of his programming that cnanot be undone. Always a risk of someone reading the words to him.
@vaderito

Spoiler:
That is incredibly sad! OMG! I hope Kylo is not as doomed to his programming as all that. I want him to be able to break it.
@SoloSideCousin

I remember the EU has this concept of the child of the Emperor...where the sith Emperor would transfer some of himself into children from different parts of the galaxy so he could control them...the only remedy was to become immersed completely in the light side of the force....maybe something like that will happen to Kylo and Snoke will lose his hold on him?
@panki

What if that's the waterfall that @vaderito and @Darth Dingbat have been discussing?
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by panki on Sat 7 May - 20:06

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@panki wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@vaderito wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@darkspellmaster wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:

I have not seen Winter Soldier. (I have a preschooler and that has seriously cut into my pop culture street cred over the past couple of years  Laughing ) I know that @vaderito is a fan of that movie.  What happens with the Winter Soldier that could apply to Kylo?  It might be a while until I can see that movie, so I'm okay being spoiled, but please put any answer inside the spoiler box so others won't be spoiled.
@SoloSideCousin ]

Spoiler:
Bucky Barns was taken in by Hydra and brainwashed into becoming an assassin for them (In the comics it was Russia). Anyway after being freed by Cap and the others he's been trying to make up for his past crimes, by not only for a while taking over as Captain America, but also as a sort of mentor to the new Patriot character in the comics. What might apply is the fact that Bucky still remembers every kill that he did, and while he feels that he was brainwashed, he still wants to make amends for his actions and save the lives of people to make up for every kill that he committed.

In the new movie he outright lets himself be put back to sleep till he can get the brainwashing out of his mind. I'm wondering if Ben would need to do something like, or a mind wipe like Revan to get rid of the influence of Snoke.
@darkspellmaster

Okay, okay! Very interesting! Hmmm .... something to think over for sure.  Thanks for getting back to me. :-)
@SoloSideCousin

Most important thing about TWS:

Spoiler:
even though he wants to make amends, he's still programmed so when someone reads him trigger words, despite his resistance, programming takes over and he becomes a killing machine. One of several trigger words, aka Manchurian words (Tony Stark even makes a Manchurian Candidate joke), is Homecoming which is Easter Egg cause Spiderman:Homecoming. By anyway, point is that nobody will ever be safe from him cause of his programming that cnanot be undone. Always a risk of someone reading the words to him.
@vaderito

Spoiler:
That is incredibly sad! OMG! I hope Kylo is not as doomed to his programming as all that.  I want him to be able to break it.
@SoloSideCousin

I remember the EU has this concept of the child of the Emperor...where the sith Emperor would transfer some of himself into children from different parts of the galaxy so he could control them...the only remedy was to become immersed completely in the light side of the force....maybe something like that will happen to Kylo and Snoke will lose his hold on him?  
@panki

What if that's the waterfall that @vaderito and @Darth Dingbat have been discussing?
@SoloSideCousin

Ohhh...that would be a nice way of showing something like this.....Luke might have been searching for this kind of solution (to help his nephew) at the first jedi temple...and this could also be the reason Kylo was looking for Luke...maybe he wanted help to prevent Snoke from getting into his head and doing that whole Manchurian candidate thing......this would cover two things in one go....gratuitous bare torso shot on one hand Twisted Evil ....and symbolic baptism and re-birth on the other.... sunny

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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Sun 8 May - 23:13

Reading Bloodline, I had a thought that occurred to me.

If Ben was badly burned in the fire at the Temple, I wonder if we could have had a situation where one or more people he trusted left him for dead, and Snoke, or someone from the FO (or the KOR) rescued him, and nursed him back to health. It was just something that occurred to me as a possible Anakin parallel.


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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by panki on Sun 8 May - 23:17

@ISeeAnIsland wrote:Reading Bloodline, I had a thought that occurred to me.

If Ben was badly burned in the fire at the Temple, I wonder if we could have had a situation where one or more people he trusted left him for dead, and Snoke, or someone from the FO (or the KOR) rescued him, and nursed him back to health. It was just something that occurred to me as a possible Anakin parallel.

@ISeeAnIsland

That is very possible! And maybe Maz picked up the legacy lightsaber from the burning ruins before the FO could get their hands on it? (She would be like the Obi-wan (kind of) of the ST....revealing to Rey about the existence of the Force)

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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by ISeeAnIsland on Mon 9 May - 16:46

Another thought from Bloodline...

I know that we'd kicked around this idea a bit before, but it seems a little more likely now (to me)...

Now we know that the public scandal that Luke and Leia were Darth Vader's children broke while Ben was off with Luke (and that Ben had previously been unaware that he was Darth Vader's grandson).

The relevant line from Han Solo describing what happened was something to the effect of "Luke was building a new Jedi order until one boy turned against him and destroyed it all."

Does it now seem more likely that that "one boy" who turned against Luke wasn't Ben? I'm not trying to let Ben off the hook here for whatever went down, but it does seem to me like there might have been motive for someone else among Luke's followers to have turned against him...

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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by Search Your Feelings on Mon 9 May - 18:13

@Iseeanisland
Interesting and possible, but personally, I can't think of another character being brought into the whole situation.  
I think it's Ben Han is referring to and he says "one boy" because he didn't want to say "my son" (either for later reveal and/or these were strangers and it's too personal). But I'm thinking it's not as black and white as Kylo killing every student there just to be darkside.  There is something else to the story that will be revealed (framed, defending himself, etc.).
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by FrolickingFizzgig on Mon 9 May - 18:16

Following up on the whole fire thing, I checked the script and saw this:
She turns to look -- we PIVOT -- and see a BURNING TEMPLE AT NIGHT. We PAN to: R2-D2 -- who watches the flames -- and a MAN appears (LUKE, whose face we do not see). He falls to his knees, reaches out to the droid -- with a MECHANICAL RIGHT HAND.

The description from the Visual Dictionary:

And here is the line from the novelization:
"Firelight illuminated her, firelight from a distant, burning temple."



The temple was specifically described as "burning" in both the script and novelization (and you can see this in the film too of course). Luke even watches the flames. I'm really liking the idea that a fire could have been the cause of the "destruction", especially because Kylo's burned training cloak emphasizes that he was actually in the fire himself.
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by Darth_Awakened on Mon 9 May - 19:16

Let me please make a little summary over here: on things we know for sure concerning temple incident and perhaps something that follows:

- Han s words to Finn and Rey:(paraphrasing): Luke was training a new generation of jedis. A boy turned against him and destroyed it all. Luke felt responsible - ran away - some people think he was looking for first jedi temple.

- Pablo s answer on when Han and Leia separated: when their son became a murderer

- a bit from vision (Luke and R2) and the bits from the script about burning temple (@FrolickingFizzgig post above)

Is that all? Please do correct me if I missed something.

(in other words: no massacre mentioned, no jedi Academy (I think that was the term from EU), no mention of threat to kill Luke himself)
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by Blackcanary on Mon 9 May - 19:20

@Darth_Awakened wrote:Let me please make a little summary over here: on things we know for sure concerning temple incident and perhaps something that follows:

- Han s words to Finn and Rey:(paraphrasing): Luke was training a new generation of jedis. A boy turned against him and destroyed it all. Luke felt responsible - ran away - some people think he was looking for first jedi temple.

- Pablo s answer on when Han and Leia separated: when their son became a murderer

- a bit from vision (Luke and R2) and the bits from the script about burning temple (@FrolickingFizzgig post above)

Is that all? Please do correct me if I missed something.

(in other words: no massacre mentioned, no jedi Academy (I think that was the term from EU), no mention of threat to kill Luke himself)
@Darth_Awakened

I've just been listening to the most recent MSW podcast and they said (paraphrasing): 'the dead students definitely exist, they built the set and we saw their lightsabers.'

Interestingly, they also commented/speculated (no idea whether there's some spoiler info behind this) that it might have been something Luke and Ben were searching for on their travels that causes discord...

Pod is https://soundcloud.com/makingstarwars/episode-129-a-han-solo-story.
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by Kessel on Mon 9 May - 19:29

I looked in the Visual Dictionary and its description of Kylo's cowl says, "Cowl is a remnant from Ren's early training.

It also describes his cape (there's a distinction made between the cowl and cape, but they appear to be the same piece of fabric/material), it says, "Cape singed from multiple battles."
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by Darth_Awakened on Mon 9 May - 19:49

@Blackcanary wrote:
I've just been listening to the most recent MSW podcast and they said (paraphrasing): 'the dead students definitely exist, they built the set and we saw their lightsabers.'

Interestingly, they also commented/speculated (no idea whether there's some spoiler info behind this) that it might have been something Luke and Ben were searching for on their travels that causes discord...

@Blackcanary

Thanks for the link. As I understood listening to that bit: the speculation on the discord during the travels - it is just a speculation - nothing more.
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by panki on Mon 9 May - 20:08

Kessel89 wrote:I looked in the Visual Dictionary and its description of Kylo's cowl says, "Cowl is a remnant from Ren's early training.

It also describes his cape (there's a distinction made between the cowl and cape, but they appear to be the same piece of fabric/material), it says, "Cape singed from multiple battles."
@Kessel89

Between the cowl and cape singed from battles and the ""Trials on Tatooine" game, I'm beginning to think Luke ran something on the lines of Thunderdome.... Shocked

But I've also wondered why Kylo's cape and cowl are black if it is from his days as a jedi apprentice....and even Luke's hooded cloak in Rey's vision was black.....since the colour of clothes have significance in SW, were they already using the dark side of the force?


Last edited by panki on Mon 9 May - 21:31; edited 1 time in total

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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by EchoBase on Mon 9 May - 20:16

@panki wrote:
Kessel89 wrote:I looked in the Visual Dictionary and its description of Kylo's cowl says, "Cowl is a remnant from Ren's early training.

It also describes his cape (there's a distinction made between the cowl and cape, but they appear to be the same piece of fabric/material), it says, "Cape singed from multiple battles."
@Kessel89

Between the cowl and cape singed from battles and the ""Trials on Tatooine" game, I'm beginning to think Luke ran something on the lines of Thunderdome.... Shocked

But I've also wondered why Kylo's cape and cowl are black if it is from his days as a jedi apprentice....and even Luke's hooded cloak in Rey's vision was black.....since the colour of clothes have significance in SW, were they already using the dark side of the force?

@panki

Things are getting really interesting. I've never noticed it before. He wouldn't have it dyed black afterwards Wink. And Luke's cape is also black in Rey's visio. Or rather dark brown, I am not sure.
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by SoloSideCousin on Mon 9 May - 22:31

@panki wrote:
Kessel89 wrote:I looked in the Visual Dictionary and its description of Kylo's cowl says, "Cowl is a remnant from Ren's early training.

It also describes his cape (there's a distinction made between the cowl and cape, but they appear to be the same piece of fabric/material), it says, "Cape singed from multiple battles."
@Kessel89

Between the cowl and cape singed from battles and the ""Trials on Tatooine" game, I'm beginning to think Luke ran something on the lines of Thunderdome.... Shocked

But I've also wondered why Kylo's cape and cowl are black if it is from his days as a jedi apprentice....and even Luke's hooded cloak in Rey's vision was black.....since the colour of clothes have significance in SW, were they already using the dark side of the force?
@panki

@panki

LOL!!! Thunderdome!!!! This is awesome!! I am still laughing right now! But seriously, it really sounds like something was going awry with Ole Luke. :-)

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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by BastilaBey on Tue 10 May - 14:37

This is a great meta about the 'massacre' now we have a little more insight from bloodline in the context of JJ's damn mystery boxes

https://oldadastra.tumblr.com/post/144138756759/bloodline-the-fall-of-ben-solo-and-the-contents
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Re: What REALLY happened at Luke's Jedi "Let's Not Call it an Academy" Place...your thoughts?

Post by snufkin on Tue 10 May - 16:00

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@panki wrote:
Kessel89 wrote:I looked in the Visual Dictionary and its description of Kylo's cowl says, "Cowl is a remnant from Ren's early training.

It also describes his cape (there's a distinction made between the cowl and cape, but they appear to be the same piece of fabric/material), it says, "Cape singed from multiple battles."
@Kessel89

Between the cowl and cape singed from battles and the ""Trials on Tatooine" game, I'm beginning to think Luke ran something on the lines of Thunderdome.... Shocked

But I've also wondered why Kylo's cape and cowl are black if it is from his days as a jedi apprentice....and even Luke's hooded cloak in Rey's vision was black.....since the colour of clothes have significance in SW, were they already using the dark side of the force?
@panki

@panki

LOL!!! Thunderdome!!!! This is awesome!! I am still laughing right now! But seriously, it really sounds like something was going awry with Ole Luke. :-)

@SoloSideCousin

Lord of the Flies style charter school is what it's starting to sound like. Somebody tell those parents to use their vouchers somewhere else!
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