Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Saracene on Fri 8 Dec - 0:01

I think it's pretty pointless trying to guess which group of people Adam has in mind when he says stuff like "truly unexpected fate".

I don't think that Kylo will join the Resistance at the end, but I'm also pretty sceptical about the idea that he'll actually succeed at overthrowing Snoke and taking over the FO. I mean, if he leads the troops on Crait it means he's not the supreme guy sitting in the chair directing everything, he's one of the ground guys.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by SoloSideCousin on Fri 8 Dec - 0:02

@ZioRen wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:I don't know if being guy or not makes any difference here, but FWIW, it does seem like she did get some pretty BS and entitled feedback, like it's her duty to tell everyone every bit of everything.  I know that would annoy me.  

Now maybe she thought just a taste would be enough, and maybe that's her mistake or maybe that's people being aggressive. She also might have gotten some wacky feedback from clueless people who thought her "Reylo is canon" post meant the moon and the stars.

Tumblr seems to be a very different environment from this board.  IOW, there seem to be much more extreme viewpoints there. So I do think it's possible that she thought she'd send people in the right direction and then a lot of people went overboard with their demands and expectations.

Something like that could cause a person to get defensive and to start worrying that people would go after her later if their definition of Reylo didn't match hers.

Now maybe she is big liar and antisocial ... but 2 years is a long freaking con ... still anything is possible.  I just think that this kind of non-nefarious reaction would be very possible.

Honestly, if I saw the movie and I was on Tumblr,  I wouldn't share anything on my Tumblr page.  It wouldn't be worth the entitled demanding b.s. of having to please everyone. I'd just figure they'll see it soon enough. And honestly, I don't know if her experience, whether she is lying or not, will keep others who might see it earlier from talking. I think it could.
@SoloSideCousin

This all is very plausible. I'll readily admit that my sort of unfortunate first instinct is to assume badly of people who leak the way she did, because I've seen people with a similar MO who were just doing it for attention multiple times. It's gotten me a little cynical, I won't lie. People were getting way aggressive but when you're giving tiny scraps to a fanbase that anyone who is on Tumblr for two seconds knows is very on edge, I don't know what else you'd expect?
@ZioRen

She might have been dumb to even try. You'd think that a person would be able to just say something vague like Reylo is good, FinnRose is good and move on, so people could have some assurance and see the movie themselves. But now it appears to be an all or nothing proposition. You either say nothing or if you open the door, you better answer every question to the nth degree or you're being a vague liar.  

She could be a vague liar, or she could have gotten a bunch of nasty emails from disgusting people or both. I just don't think it should be a situation where if you open the door that people can ask anything of you. But if it is, then so be it. People just won't say anything under those circumstances.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by reylo1992 on Fri 8 Dec - 0:03

@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@CienaRee wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:I wouldn't say she backtracked. Assuming for 2 seconds she's telling the truth the vibe I got was that they have amazing scenes together, an incredible connection and in her opinion things are looking very hopeful for the future of their storyline. HOWEVER, it's not totally smooth sailing (duh). Antis will be happy because there's no kiss, which I'm personally happy to hear.
@FrolickingFizzgig

What I pulled from it is that there's no overt romance and the ending of the movie is going to cause some anxiety for some Reylo fans. Probably because Kylo isn't definitively on any side (which was my ending prediction anyways).

But the way these things have been leaked is way sketchy to me. I'm sure JWT may believe her, but I keep seeing her and others use anonymous sources as proof of the leaks. I simply can't trust that.
@ZioRen

I found it believable at first, but the more I think about it, the more I think she just read the VD.  We know now it was a retail employee who got the shipment ahead of schedule.  I doubt that person was the only one who looked at it.  The Force Ghost stuff might be a good guess.

Also, she lost credibility with me when she said both ants and Reylos will get the good and bad.  Sorry, but if we get ANY hint of Reylo, the ants have lost - period.  There isn't much middle ground there.  If she's talking about Kylo's redemption in the second movie being a bumpy ride, sure - I can buy that.  Still with that wording she seemed to be talking out of both sides of her mouth.
@IoJovi

What if Kylo bertrays Rey but we can see it really isn't a bertryal per se, he has his agenda and Rey would understand. But antis will see it as this, claiming victory. Basically both sides of the barricade seeing it the way they want to, which sort of fits ambiguity statement from Adam and Rian.

I don't think reyloismine has any reason to please antis, been on tumblr for quite some time.
@DarthRen

That's possible but I think it some anons on tumblr told Kylorenema that Kylo and Rey don't betray each other which could be false but I'm thinking would Daisy called their relationship awesome if Kylo betrays her?
@CienaRee

Like I said, bertrayal might not be the right word to use, ambiguity comes into play. We might view it one way, they can view the other because they are antis. I think reyloismine sort of in my opinion implies on this. Antis will get theirs because we've seen them celebrating things that clearly means something different.
@DarthRen

Adam has repeatedly said that Rian trusts that the audience can handle nuance and ambiguity. Personally, I believe in the idea that no side will really have won at the end of the movie. From what I've read above, Kylo and Rey may want to be together but there will be probably something that will prevent them from remaining together after their unexpected alliance. If not, I don't see where would be the romantic drama at all.

And I know that we have a hard time recognizing it as Reylos but there are IMO several hints suggesting that Kylo won't switch side by the end of the movie + Adam repeatedly  saying that he will  have a "truly unexpected fate": that kind of expression was never ever used to describe the fate of any other character. What can make one what want from this but from my side that doesn't scream to me "Kylo leaves the FO to help the Resistance" because this is something so many people want/expect.

The SW database made it pretty clear that Kylo is someone who first and foremost has personal allegiance and that his personal allegiance to Snoke will collide with his personal allegiance to Rey. It doesn't mean through that he will be willing to change his commitment to the FO to join the Resistance.
So the question is: what will he do once he indeed chooses his loyalty to Rey over Snoke's? What would be the obstacle at the heart of the romantic drama by the end of the movie? I.e. the visual dictionary makes pretty clear that he is the one leading the battle of Crait in order to defeat the Resistance. And if that indeed happens after Supremacy:  where the hell is Snoke? Why is Kylo still in charge of the FO ? And the same visual dictionary also hints at Kylo  kinda thirsty for power and cleverly ploting his own path. Plus Rian saying months ago "he is not Vader yet" and the Asian describing him as a "villain we can relate to" (still a villain).

[edit]

I don't know what it means in the end but I don't see why there would be any misdirection in official infos. I think that's fair to the Antis to recognize that not the whole stuff we get screams romantic Reylo in TLJ although I have no doubt it will ultimately happen  by the end of the ST.
@reylo1992

Becoming Vader, Renperor is not something truly unexpected either. Unless Adam is wording the way to hype people.

Renisthekey is faf but I like that idea of Kylo and Snoke using each other and that Kylo wants to get rid of him, but need to go fully dark in rder to do so. People can then debate whether he's doing it for noble reason or selfish. Nuance and ambiguity. Basically rulling in his own way, preferably with his other half Rey and get rid of someone like Snoke. Ruling with iron fist but also not cruel like Snoke, only doing things he meant to do. Rey will probably try to bring him back, creating conflict for him, her and everyone else. She can understand him better than anyone.

I don't think Kylo will be Ben Solo in TLJ or fighting with Resistance, nor will he be under command of Snoke. His own path is the most logical way VD supports.
@DarthRen

Agree that Renperor itself ain't unexpected. IMO the way things are gonna turn depends heavily on what Snoke will do after Supremacy and what will be the consequences of Kylo's actions on his own agenda.

Like I wrote several times, I have a hard time to think that someone like Snoke described as very powerful and at the end of darkness would give up like that, especially if he sees Kylo's betrayal as highly personal.

I've always found that this lines of the novelization and the SW databank are pretty telling in regard to the fact that the allegiance of Kylo to Snoke is personal:

My allegiance is with you
==> Kylo could have said "with the FO"

And you promised me, when it comes to destroy the Resistance, you wouldn't fail me
==> not the FO but me

Kylo swore his allegiance was only to Snoke but he was intrigued when he captured Rey
==> Once again, personal allegiance

Now, I don't know what will happen. If someone I have a close bond with was ploting against me to go his own path and would ultimately betray me at the crucial moment, I would be surely very pissed. And if I would be as dark, powerful and  revengeful as Snoke, I would surely make that person pay for the personal betrayal. And visual dictionary hinting that Snoke is hiding his true nature makes me think that we will only get a glimpse on Supremacy of what the guy is able to do. So I put my money that we won't be done yet with Snoke as the Supremacy arc ends. There is no way IMO that the SW crew would spoil the real climax of the movie the way they do with that scene in the throne room, purposefully hiding what is really going on Crait later.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by motherofpearl1 on Fri 8 Dec - 0:09

I have a firm belief Kylo will never join the Resistance, even if he is redeemed. They are not his kind of people, and I honestly don't think Rey will stay with them either.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by reylo1992 on Fri 8 Dec - 0:13

@ZioRen wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:I don't know if being guy or not makes any difference here, but FWIW, it does seem like she did get some pretty BS and entitled feedback, like it's her duty to tell everyone every bit of everything.  I know that would annoy me.  

Now maybe she thought just a taste would be enough, and maybe that's her mistake or maybe that's people being aggressive. She also might have gotten some wacky feedback from clueless people who thought her "Reylo is canon" post meant the moon and the stars.

Tumblr seems to be a very different environment from this board.  IOW, there seem to be much more extreme viewpoints there. So I do think it's possible that she thought she'd send people in the right direction and then a lot of people went overboard with their demands and expectations.

Something like that could cause a person to get defensive and to start worrying that people would go after her later if their definition of Reylo didn't match hers.

Now maybe she is big liar and antisocial ... but 2 years is a long freaking con ... still anything is possible.  I just think that this kind of non-nefarious reaction would be very possible.

Honestly, if I saw the movie and I was on Tumblr,  I wouldn't share anything on my Tumblr page.  It wouldn't be worth the entitled demanding b.s. of having to please everyone. I'd just figure they'll see it soon enough. And honestly, I don't know if her experience, whether she is lying or not, will keep others who might see it earlier from talking. I think it could.
@SoloSideCousin

This all is very plausible. I'll readily admit that my sort of unfortunate first instinct is to assume badly of people who leak the way she did, because I've seen people with a similar MO who were just doing it for attention multiple times. It's gotten me a little cynical, I won't lie. People were getting way aggressive but when you're giving tiny scraps to a fanbase that anyone who is on Tumblr for two seconds knows is very on edge, I don't know what else you'd expect?
@ZioRen

The problem is that she is in an unconfortable situation. The movie only comes out next week. If she gives away the spoilers, the problem is that there will be massive reblogs and in the end, people who didn't want to be spoiled too much would get too many informations. People who PM her and get answer would probably spread the informations. So remaining vague is the only way to protect the fandom to get spoiled about details most people don't want to know. IMO she better have said that she saw the movie, just said what she thought and not have given any detail or maybe only one not too spoilery detail and saying "I am waiting that the movie officially comes out to spoil". But I guess she got overwhelmed by the reactions she got and maybe didn't know how to handle it. Who knows? Personally, I don't see why she would lie and there is no real incidence since she didn't give away any big spoiler.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by MoonFyre on Fri 8 Dec - 0:17

Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by ZioRen on Fri 8 Dec - 0:18

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:I don't know if being guy or not makes any difference here, but FWIW, it does seem like she did get some pretty BS and entitled feedback, like it's her duty to tell everyone every bit of everything.  I know that would annoy me.  

Now maybe she thought just a taste would be enough, and maybe that's her mistake or maybe that's people being aggressive. She also might have gotten some wacky feedback from clueless people who thought her "Reylo is canon" post meant the moon and the stars.

Tumblr seems to be a very different environment from this board.  IOW, there seem to be much more extreme viewpoints there. So I do think it's possible that she thought she'd send people in the right direction and then a lot of people went overboard with their demands and expectations.

Something like that could cause a person to get defensive and to start worrying that people would go after her later if their definition of Reylo didn't match hers.

Now maybe she is big liar and antisocial ... but 2 years is a long freaking con ... still anything is possible.  I just think that this kind of non-nefarious reaction would be very possible.

Honestly, if I saw the movie and I was on Tumblr,  I wouldn't share anything on my Tumblr page.  It wouldn't be worth the entitled demanding b.s. of having to please everyone. I'd just figure they'll see it soon enough. And honestly, I don't know if her experience, whether she is lying or not, will keep others who might see it earlier from talking. I think it could.
@SoloSideCousin

This all is very plausible. I'll readily admit that my sort of unfortunate first instinct is to assume badly of people who leak the way she did, because I've seen people with a similar MO who were just doing it for attention multiple times. It's gotten me a little cynical, I won't lie. People were getting way aggressive but when you're giving tiny scraps to a fanbase that anyone who is on Tumblr for two seconds knows is very on edge, I don't know what else you'd expect?
@ZioRen

She might have been dumb to even try. You'd think that a person would be able to just say something vague like Reylo is good, FinnRose is good and move on, so people could have some assurance and see the movie themselves. But now it appears to be an all or nothing proposition. You either say nothing or if you open the door, you better answer every question to the nth degree or you're being a vague liar.  

She could be a vague liar, or she could have gotten a bunch of nasty emails from disgusting people or both. I just don't think it should be a situation where if you open the door that people can ask anything of you. But if it is, then so be it. People just won't say anything under those circumstances.
@SoloSideCousin

I think where she fell down the rabbithole was saying Reylos should manage expectations and hinting that antis would partially be happy too. That's probably where the wave of anger started crashing in, because she was creating doubts intead of assuaging them. I think she also may have eventually drawn attention from people outside of Tumblr or from other forums. And they can be...well, not so nice.

With this sort of stuff, it's all about gauging your audience. I have many who probably don't agree with me, but I'm of a mind that if you don't plan to go in and answer a lot of questions, give your vague impression and then be done with it. Especially in something as huge and followed as Star Wars. Stick to your guns. Picking and choosing what to answer, and making teasing little posts, is how you start a fire you might not be able to handle (assuming that wasn't your intention in the first place. For some people it is.) But to be fair, I've had ample experience with this sort of stuff now and she may not have. I've seen the leak fiascos go down far too many times.  Laughing

She's at least lucky that she had some proof with the green milk detail in the VD. Although maybe it wasn't ideal in the end, since now people have a laser focus on her!
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by ZioRen on Fri 8 Dec - 0:23

@MoonFyre wrote:Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
@MoonFyre

Well I can't imagine them becoming allies and not coming to an understanding, so it must be the other way around! To me, this sounds like what some people have been speculating: Kylo potentially ends TLJ on no side.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by MoonFyre on Fri 8 Dec - 0:26

@ZioRen wrote:
@MoonFyre wrote:Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
@MoonFyre

Well I can't imagine them becoming allies and not coming to an understanding, so it must be the other way around! To me, this sounds like what some people have been speculating: Kylo potentially ends TLJ on no side.
@ZioRen

It sounds like they will end up as uneasy allies. I wish she said more, but she's very tight lipped lol.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by SoloSideCousin on Fri 8 Dec - 0:27

@MoonFyre wrote:Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
@MoonFyre

Now that is a confusing answer. Half of it is wrong would either mean allies but no understanding or understanding but not allies.  Not "somewhat." Yeah, the verbal abilities and interpretation abilities might not be excellent here.

Do you know her at all from before?
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by DarthRen on Fri 8 Dec - 0:30

@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@CienaRee wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:I wouldn't say she backtracked. Assuming for 2 seconds she's telling the truth the vibe I got was that they have amazing scenes together, an incredible connection and in her opinion things are looking very hopeful for the future of their storyline. HOWEVER, it's not totally smooth sailing (duh). Antis will be happy because there's no kiss, which I'm personally happy to hear.
@FrolickingFizzgig

What I pulled from it is that there's no overt romance and the ending of the movie is going to cause some anxiety for some Reylo fans. Probably because Kylo isn't definitively on any side (which was my ending prediction anyways).

But the way these things have been leaked is way sketchy to me. I'm sure JWT may believe her, but I keep seeing her and others use anonymous sources as proof of the leaks. I simply can't trust that.
@ZioRen

I found it believable at first, but the more I think about it, the more I think she just read the VD.  We know now it was a retail employee who got the shipment ahead of schedule.  I doubt that person was the only one who looked at it.  The Force Ghost stuff might be a good guess.

Also, she lost credibility with me when she said both ants and Reylos will get the good and bad.  Sorry, but if we get ANY hint of Reylo, the ants have lost - period.  There isn't much middle ground there.  If she's talking about Kylo's redemption in the second movie being a bumpy ride, sure - I can buy that.  Still with that wording she seemed to be talking out of both sides of her mouth.
@IoJovi

What if Kylo bertrays Rey but we can see it really isn't a bertryal per se, he has his agenda and Rey would understand. But antis will see it as this, claiming victory. Basically both sides of the barricade seeing it the way they want to, which sort of fits ambiguity statement from Adam and Rian.

I don't think reyloismine has any reason to please antis, been on tumblr for quite some time.
@DarthRen

That's possible but I think it some anons on tumblr told Kylorenema that Kylo and Rey don't betray each other which could be false but I'm thinking would Daisy called their relationship awesome if Kylo betrays her?
@CienaRee

Like I said, bertrayal might not be the right word to use, ambiguity comes into play. We might view it one way, they can view the other because they are antis. I think reyloismine sort of in my opinion implies on this. Antis will get theirs because we've seen them celebrating things that clearly means something different.
@DarthRen

Adam has repeatedly said that Rian trusts that the audience can handle nuance and ambiguity. Personally, I believe in the idea that no side will really have won at the end of the movie. From what I've read above, Kylo and Rey may want to be together but there will be probably something that will prevent them from remaining together after their unexpected alliance. If not, I don't see where would be the romantic drama at all.

And I know that we have a hard time recognizing it as Reylos but there are IMO several hints suggesting that Kylo won't switch side by the end of the movie + Adam repeatedly  saying that he will  have a "truly unexpected fate": that kind of expression was never ever used to describe the fate of any other character. What can make one what want from this but from my side that doesn't scream to me "Kylo leaves the FO to help the Resistance" because this is something so many people want/expect.

The SW database made it pretty clear that Kylo is someone who first and foremost has personal allegiance and that his personal allegiance to Snoke will collide with his personal allegiance to Rey. It doesn't mean through that he will be willing to change his commitment to the FO to join the Resistance.
So the question is: what will he do once he indeed chooses his loyalty to Rey over Snoke's? What would be the obstacle at the heart of the romantic drama by the end of the movie? I.e. the visual dictionary makes pretty clear that he is the one leading the battle of Crait in order to defeat the Resistance. And if that indeed happens after Supremacy:  where the hell is Snoke? Why is Kylo still in charge of the FO ? And the same visual dictionary also hints at Kylo  kinda thirsty for power and cleverly ploting his own path. Plus Rian saying months ago "he is not Vader yet" and the Asian describing him as a "villain we can relate to" (still a villain).

[edit]

I don't know what it means in the end but I don't see why there would be any misdirection in official infos. I think that's fair to the Antis to recognize that not the whole stuff we get screams romantic Reylo in TLJ although I have no doubt it will ultimately happen  by the end of the ST.
@reylo1992

Becoming Vader, Renperor is not something truly unexpected either. Unless Adam is wording the way to hype people.

Renisthekey is faf but I like that idea of Kylo and Snoke using each other and that Kylo wants to get rid of him, but need to go fully dark in rder to do so. People can then debate whether he's doing it for noble reason or selfish. Nuance and ambiguity. Basically rulling in his own way, preferably with his other half Rey and get rid of someone like Snoke. Ruling with iron fist but also not cruel like Snoke, only doing things he meant to do. Rey will probably try to bring him back, creating conflict for him, her and everyone else. She can understand him better than anyone.

I don't think Kylo will be Ben Solo in TLJ or fighting with Resistance, nor will he be under command of Snoke. His own path is the most logical way VD supports.
@DarthRen

Agree that Renperor itself ain't unexpected. IMO the way things are gonna turn depends heavily on what Snoke will do after Supremacy and what will be the consequences of Kylo's actions on his own agenda.

Like I wrote several times, I have a hard time to think that someone like Snoke described as very powerful and at the end of darkness would give up like that, especially if he sees Kylo's betrayal as highly personal.

I've always found that this lines of the novelization and the SW databank are pretty telling in regard to the fact that the allegiance of Kylo to Snoke is personal:

My allegiance is with you
==> Kylo could have said "with the FO"

And you promised me, when it comes to destroy the Resistance, you wouldn't fail me
==> not the FO but me

Kylo swore his allegiance was only to Snoke but he was intrigued when he captured Rey
==> Once again, personal allegiance

Now, I don't know what will happen. If someone I have a close bond with was ploting against me to go his own path and would ultimately betray me at the crucial moment, I would be surely very pissed. And if I would be as dark, powerful and  revengeful as Snoke, I would surely make that person pay for the personal betrayal. And visual dictionary hinting that Snoke is hiding his true nature makes me think that we will only get a glimpse on Supremacy of what the guy is able to do. So I put my money that we won't be done yet with Snoke as the Supremacy arc ends. There is no way IMO that the SW crew would spoil the real climax of the movie the way they do with that scene in the throne room, purposefully hiding what is really going on Crait later.
@reylo1992

Don't forget Kylo Ren is just a role, we might be surprised that he has his own agenda. Being Snoke's lackey is far from interesting, Kylo is plenty powerful by all accounts. He's working on something that might be perceived in both ways good and bad. No doubt Snoke will be powerful but he's also weakened. I don't see Kylo under his command anymore, doing his own thing whatever that is.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by SoloSideCousin on Fri 8 Dec - 0:31

@ZioRen wrote:
@MoonFyre wrote:Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
@MoonFyre

Well I can't imagine them becoming allies and not coming to an understanding, so it must be the other way around! To me, this sounds like what some people have been speculating: Kylo potentially ends TLJ on no side.
@ZioRen

I think you are right. I think that she will have an understanding with him, but he will be his own rogue guy. If the Kylorenema/Jediwhinetrick stuff is right, then that information supports this conclusion as well. Basically there is a strong connection between them, but outside forces are keeping them apart. Super romantic drama there. Very Happy I hope those Kylorenema and Jediwhinetrick people are on the level, because I like those leaks a lot.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by ZioRen on Fri 8 Dec - 0:33

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@MoonFyre wrote:Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
@MoonFyre

Well I can't imagine them becoming allies and not coming to an understanding, so it must be the other way around! To me, this sounds like what some people have been speculating: Kylo potentially ends TLJ on no side.
@ZioRen

I think you are right. I think that she will have an understanding with him, but he will be his own rogue guy. If the Kylorenema/Jediwhinetrick stuff is right, then that information supports this conclusion as well. Basically there is a strong connection between them, but outside forces are keeping them apart. Super romantic drama there. Very Happy I hope those Kylorenema and Jediwhinetrick people are on the level, because I like those leaks a lot.
@SoloSideCousin

Here's where it gets funny: I'm pretty sure Jediwhinetrick is using Reyloismine as the basis for thinking the anons leaking things to Kylorenema are legitimate. If that's true, that implies that this is what Reyloismine is saying happens.

I wonder what the bad scenes are? If I had to guess, it might have to do with how Kylo acts when he first gets to Ahch-To. He may be trying to kill Rey at first.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by DarthRen on Fri 8 Dec - 0:33

@MoonFyre wrote:Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
@MoonFyre

Sounds like one step forward, two steps back. That redditor said something too about uneasy alliance but I think many people can guess that.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by SoloSideCousin on Fri 8 Dec - 0:35

@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@CienaRee wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:I wouldn't say she backtracked. Assuming for 2 seconds she's telling the truth the vibe I got was that they have amazing scenes together, an incredible connection and in her opinion things are looking very hopeful for the future of their storyline. HOWEVER, it's not totally smooth sailing (duh). Antis will be happy because there's no kiss, which I'm personally happy to hear.
@FrolickingFizzgig

What I pulled from it is that there's no overt romance and the ending of the movie is going to cause some anxiety for some Reylo fans. Probably because Kylo isn't definitively on any side (which was my ending prediction anyways).

But the way these things have been leaked is way sketchy to me. I'm sure JWT may believe her, but I keep seeing her and others use anonymous sources as proof of the leaks. I simply can't trust that.
@ZioRen

I found it believable at first, but the more I think about it, the more I think she just read the VD.  We know now it was a retail employee who got the shipment ahead of schedule.  I doubt that person was the only one who looked at it.  The Force Ghost stuff might be a good guess.

Also, she lost credibility with me when she said both ants and Reylos will get the good and bad.  Sorry, but if we get ANY hint of Reylo, the ants have lost - period.  There isn't much middle ground there.  If she's talking about Kylo's redemption in the second movie being a bumpy ride, sure - I can buy that.  Still with that wording she seemed to be talking out of both sides of her mouth.
@IoJovi

What if Kylo bertrays Rey but we can see it really isn't a bertryal per se, he has his agenda and Rey would understand. But antis will see it as this, claiming victory. Basically both sides of the barricade seeing it the way they want to, which sort of fits ambiguity statement from Adam and Rian.

I don't think reyloismine has any reason to please antis, been on tumblr for quite some time.
@DarthRen

That's possible but I think it some anons on tumblr told Kylorenema that Kylo and Rey don't betray each other which could be false but I'm thinking would Daisy called their relationship awesome if Kylo betrays her?
@CienaRee

Like I said, bertrayal might not be the right word to use, ambiguity comes into play. We might view it one way, they can view the other because they are antis. I think reyloismine sort of in my opinion implies on this. Antis will get theirs because we've seen them celebrating things that clearly means something different.
@DarthRen

Adam has repeatedly said that Rian trusts that the audience can handle nuance and ambiguity. Personally, I believe in the idea that no side will really have won at the end of the movie. From what I've read above, Kylo and Rey may want to be together but there will be probably something that will prevent them from remaining together after their unexpected alliance. If not, I don't see where would be the romantic drama at all.

And I know that we have a hard time recognizing it as Reylos but there are IMO several hints suggesting that Kylo won't switch side by the end of the movie + Adam repeatedly  saying that he will  have a "truly unexpected fate": that kind of expression was never ever used to describe the fate of any other character. What can make one what want from this but from my side that doesn't scream to me "Kylo leaves the FO to help the Resistance" because this is something so many people want/expect.

The SW database made it pretty clear that Kylo is someone who first and foremost has personal allegiance and that his personal allegiance to Snoke will collide with his personal allegiance to Rey. It doesn't mean through that he will be willing to change his commitment to the FO to join the Resistance.
So the question is: what will he do once he indeed chooses his loyalty to Rey over Snoke's? What would be the obstacle at the heart of the romantic drama by the end of the movie? I.e. the visual dictionary makes pretty clear that he is the one leading the battle of Crait in order to defeat the Resistance. And if that indeed happens after Supremacy:  where the hell is Snoke? Why is Kylo still in charge of the FO ? And the same visual dictionary also hints at Kylo  kinda thirsty for power and cleverly ploting his own path. Plus Rian saying months ago "he is not Vader yet" and the Asian describing him as a "villain we can relate to" (still a villain).

[edit]

I don't know what it means in the end but I don't see why there would be any misdirection in official infos. I think that's fair to the Antis to recognize that not the whole stuff we get screams romantic Reylo in TLJ although I have no doubt it will ultimately happen  by the end of the ST.
@reylo1992

Becoming Vader, Renperor is not something truly unexpected either. Unless Adam is wording the way to hype people.

Renisthekey is faf but I like that idea of Kylo and Snoke using each other and that Kylo wants to get rid of him, but need to go fully dark in rder to do so. People can then debate whether he's doing it for noble reason or selfish. Nuance and ambiguity. Basically rulling in his own way, preferably with his other half Rey and get rid of someone like Snoke. Ruling with iron fist but also not cruel like Snoke, only doing things he meant to do. Rey will probably try to bring him back, creating conflict for him, her and everyone else. She can understand him better than anyone.

I don't think Kylo will be Ben Solo in TLJ or fighting with Resistance, nor will he be under command of Snoke. His own path is the most logical way VD supports.
@DarthRen

Agree that Renperor itself ain't unexpected. IMO the way things are gonna turn depends heavily on what Snoke will do after Supremacy and what will be the consequences of Kylo's actions on his own agenda.

Like I wrote several times, I have a hard time to think that someone like Snoke described as very powerful and at the end of darkness would give up like that, especially if he sees Kylo's betrayal as highly personal.

I've always found that this lines of the novelization and the SW databank are pretty telling in regard to the fact that the allegiance of Kylo to Snoke is personal:

My allegiance is with you
==> Kylo could have said "with the FO"

And you promised me, when it comes to destroy the Resistance, you wouldn't fail me
==> not the FO but me

Kylo swore his allegiance was only to Snoke but he was intrigued when he captured Rey
==> Once again, personal allegiance

Now, I don't know what will happen. If someone I have a close bond with was ploting against me to go his own path and would ultimately betray me at the crucial moment, I would be surely very pissed. And if I would be as dark, powerful and  revengeful as Snoke, I would surely make that person pay for the personal betrayal. And visual dictionary hinting that Snoke is hiding his true nature makes me think that we will only get a glimpse on Supremacy of what the guy is able to do. So I put my money that we won't be done yet with Snoke as the Supremacy arc ends. There is no way IMO that the SW crew would spoil the real climax of the movie the way they do with that scene in the throne room, purposefully hiding what is really going on Crait later.
@reylo1992

Don't forget Kylo Ren is just a role, we might be surprised that he has his own agenda. Being Snoke's lackey is far from interesting, Kylo is plenty powerful by all accounts. He's working on something that might be perceived in both ways good and bad. No doubt Snoke will be powerful but he's also weakened. I don't see Kylo under his command anymore, doing his own thing whatever that is.
@DarthRen

Yeah, Kylo could be very "grey" at the end of TLJ.  The Jediwhinetrick and Kylorenema people did say that he wasn't dark, but he wasn't light either. His agenda might be a mixed bag that Rey may not be prepared to get onboard with yet.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by SoloSideCousin on Fri 8 Dec - 0:40

@ZioRen wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@MoonFyre wrote:Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
@MoonFyre

Well I can't imagine them becoming allies and not coming to an understanding, so it must be the other way around! To me, this sounds like what some people have been speculating: Kylo potentially ends TLJ on no side.
@ZioRen

I think you are right. I think that she will have an understanding with him, but he will be his own rogue guy. If the Kylorenema/Jediwhinetrick stuff is right, then that information supports this conclusion as well. Basically there is a strong connection between them, but outside forces are keeping them apart. Super romantic drama there. Very Happy I hope those Kylorenema and Jediwhinetrick people are on the level, because I like those leaks a lot.
@SoloSideCousin

Here's where it gets funny: I'm pretty sure Jediwhinetrick is using Reyloismine as the basis for thinking the anons leaking things to Kylorenema are legitimate. If that's true, that implies that this is what Reyloismine is saying happens.

I wonder what the bad scenes are? If I had to guess, it might have to do with how Kylo acts when he first gets to Ahch-To. He may be trying to kill Rey at first.
@ZioRen

Yeah, did Reyloismine decide to just go through an intermediary?

Also, the jediwhinetrick person says that he does not betray Rey and she does not betray him. But that doesn't mean that there won't be some ugliness. Both of these people have tempers and Adam has a set of lungs in him. I could see Rian putting Adam's yelling voice to good use. And frankly, whether he wants to kill her on Ahch-to or not, he is going to be a mess and will not have tolerance for anything. That could lead to a nasty argument at the very least.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by MoonFyre on Fri 8 Dec - 0:41

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@MoonFyre wrote:Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
@MoonFyre

Now that is a confusing answer. Half of it is wrong would either mean allies but no understanding or understanding but not allies.  Not "somewhat." Yeah, the verbal abilities and interpretation abilities might not be excellent here.

Do you know her at all from before?
@SoloSideCousin

Not very well, but I've been following her in tumblr since last year. She's formerly 'Reylolicious'.

@DarthRen You mean RenistheKey? I thought he was fake.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by SoloSideCousin on Fri 8 Dec - 0:44

@MoonFyre wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@MoonFyre wrote:Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
@MoonFyre

Now that is a confusing answer. Half of it is wrong would either mean allies but no understanding or understanding but not allies.  Not "somewhat." Yeah, the verbal abilities and interpretation abilities might not be excellent here.

Do you know her at all from before?
@SoloSideCousin

Not very well, but I've been following her in tumblr since last year. She's formerly 'Reylolicious'.

@DarthRen You mean RenistheKey? I thought he was fake.
@MoonFyre

Okay, that's good. Very Happy That means she has been normal all along. I also was probably too hard on her with the poor interpretation remark. If this is all kosher,  she is in a tough spot.


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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by DarthRen on Fri 8 Dec - 0:51

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@CienaRee wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:I wouldn't say she backtracked. Assuming for 2 seconds she's telling the truth the vibe I got was that they have amazing scenes together, an incredible connection and in her opinion things are looking very hopeful for the future of their storyline. HOWEVER, it's not totally smooth sailing (duh). Antis will be happy because there's no kiss, which I'm personally happy to hear.
@FrolickingFizzgig

What I pulled from it is that there's no overt romance and the ending of the movie is going to cause some anxiety for some Reylo fans. Probably because Kylo isn't definitively on any side (which was my ending prediction anyways).

But the way these things have been leaked is way sketchy to me. I'm sure JWT may believe her, but I keep seeing her and others use anonymous sources as proof of the leaks. I simply can't trust that.
@ZioRen

I found it believable at first, but the more I think about it, the more I think she just read the VD.  We know now it was a retail employee who got the shipment ahead of schedule.  I doubt that person was the only one who looked at it.  The Force Ghost stuff might be a good guess.

Also, she lost credibility with me when she said both ants and Reylos will get the good and bad.  Sorry, but if we get ANY hint of Reylo, the ants have lost - period.  There isn't much middle ground there.  If she's talking about Kylo's redemption in the second movie being a bumpy ride, sure - I can buy that.  Still with that wording she seemed to be talking out of both sides of her mouth.
@IoJovi

What if Kylo bertrays Rey but we can see it really isn't a bertryal per se, he has his agenda and Rey would understand. But antis will see it as this, claiming victory. Basically both sides of the barricade seeing it the way they want to, which sort of fits ambiguity statement from Adam and Rian.

I don't think reyloismine has any reason to please antis, been on tumblr for quite some time.
@DarthRen

That's possible but I think it some anons on tumblr told Kylorenema that Kylo and Rey don't betray each other which could be false but I'm thinking would Daisy called their relationship awesome if Kylo betrays her?
@CienaRee

Like I said, bertrayal might not be the right word to use, ambiguity comes into play. We might view it one way, they can view the other because they are antis. I think reyloismine sort of in my opinion implies on this. Antis will get theirs because we've seen them celebrating things that clearly means something different.
@DarthRen

Adam has repeatedly said that Rian trusts that the audience can handle nuance and ambiguity. Personally, I believe in the idea that no side will really have won at the end of the movie. From what I've read above, Kylo and Rey may want to be together but there will be probably something that will prevent them from remaining together after their unexpected alliance. If not, I don't see where would be the romantic drama at all.

And I know that we have a hard time recognizing it as Reylos but there are IMO several hints suggesting that Kylo won't switch side by the end of the movie + Adam repeatedly  saying that he will  have a "truly unexpected fate": that kind of expression was never ever used to describe the fate of any other character. What can make one what want from this but from my side that doesn't scream to me "Kylo leaves the FO to help the Resistance" because this is something so many people want/expect.

The SW database made it pretty clear that Kylo is someone who first and foremost has personal allegiance and that his personal allegiance to Snoke will collide with his personal allegiance to Rey. It doesn't mean through that he will be willing to change his commitment to the FO to join the Resistance.
So the question is: what will he do once he indeed chooses his loyalty to Rey over Snoke's? What would be the obstacle at the heart of the romantic drama by the end of the movie? I.e. the visual dictionary makes pretty clear that he is the one leading the battle of Crait in order to defeat the Resistance. And if that indeed happens after Supremacy:  where the hell is Snoke? Why is Kylo still in charge of the FO ? And the same visual dictionary also hints at Kylo  kinda thirsty for power and cleverly ploting his own path. Plus Rian saying months ago "he is not Vader yet" and the Asian describing him as a "villain we can relate to" (still a villain).

[edit]

I don't know what it means in the end but I don't see why there would be any misdirection in official infos. I think that's fair to the Antis to recognize that not the whole stuff we get screams romantic Reylo in TLJ although I have no doubt it will ultimately happen  by the end of the ST.
@reylo1992

Becoming Vader, Renperor is not something truly unexpected either. Unless Adam is wording the way to hype people.

Renisthekey is faf but I like that idea of Kylo and Snoke using each other and that Kylo wants to get rid of him, but need to go fully dark in rder to do so. People can then debate whether he's doing it for noble reason or selfish. Nuance and ambiguity. Basically rulling in his own way, preferably with his other half Rey and get rid of someone like Snoke. Ruling with iron fist but also not cruel like Snoke, only doing things he meant to do. Rey will probably try to bring him back, creating conflict for him, her and everyone else. She can understand him better than anyone.

I don't think Kylo will be Ben Solo in TLJ or fighting with Resistance, nor will he be under command of Snoke. His own path is the most logical way VD supports.
@DarthRen

Agree that Renperor itself ain't unexpected. IMO the way things are gonna turn depends heavily on what Snoke will do after Supremacy and what will be the consequences of Kylo's actions on his own agenda.

Like I wrote several times, I have a hard time to think that someone like Snoke described as very powerful and at the end of darkness would give up like that, especially if he sees Kylo's betrayal as highly personal.

I've always found that this lines of the novelization and the SW databank are pretty telling in regard to the fact that the allegiance of Kylo to Snoke is personal:

My allegiance is with you
==> Kylo could have said "with the FO"

And you promised me, when it comes to destroy the Resistance, you wouldn't fail me
==> not the FO but me

Kylo swore his allegiance was only to Snoke but he was intrigued when he captured Rey
==> Once again, personal allegiance

Now, I don't know what will happen. If someone I have a close bond with was ploting against me to go his own path and would ultimately betray me at the crucial moment, I would be surely very pissed. And if I would be as dark, powerful and  revengeful as Snoke, I would surely make that person pay for the personal betrayal. And visual dictionary hinting that Snoke is hiding his true nature makes me think that we will only get a glimpse on Supremacy of what the guy is able to do. So I put my money that we won't be done yet with Snoke as the Supremacy arc ends. There is no way IMO that the SW crew would spoil the real climax of the movie the way they do with that scene in the throne room, purposefully hiding what is really going on Crait later.
@reylo1992

Don't forget Kylo Ren is just a role, we might be surprised that he has his own agenda. Being Snoke's lackey is far from interesting, Kylo is plenty powerful by all accounts. He's working on something that might be perceived in both ways good and bad. No doubt Snoke will be powerful but he's also weakened. I don't see Kylo under his command anymore, doing his own thing whatever that is.
@DarthRen

Yeah, Kylo could be very "grey" at the end of TLJ.  The Jediwhinetrick and Kylorenema people did say that he wasn't dark, but he wasn't light either. His agenda might be a mixed bag that Rey may not be prepared to get onboard with yet.
@SoloSideCousin

Pretty much, Kylo being his own man, grey, anti-hero is most likely because I don't think in his own mind he feels that he belongs to the Resistance or FO. He'll see that Snoke is using him but also that he's far too deep in this to just go back to Lea and his family. I can see him ending in a very lonely and dark place but with a sense of purpose and discovery what he has to do and who he wants to be. This might not fly well with Rey, who will be confused by their bond like Kylo but also what he wants to do. Both will develop feelings for each other but not act upon it, wanting to be around one another too many things happening around them or their motives will prevent it. I see a pretty bumpy road but eventually sorting things out.



@MoonFyre

He's fake but also said Kylo and Rey will have uneasy alliance, like folks on tumblr. That can be predicted by anyone.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by reylo1992 on Fri 8 Dec - 1:00

@DarthRen wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@CienaRee wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:I wouldn't say she backtracked. Assuming for 2 seconds she's telling the truth the vibe I got was that they have amazing scenes together, an incredible connection and in her opinion things are looking very hopeful for the future of their storyline. HOWEVER, it's not totally smooth sailing (duh). Antis will be happy because there's no kiss, which I'm personally happy to hear.
@FrolickingFizzgig

What I pulled from it is that there's no overt romance and the ending of the movie is going to cause some anxiety for some Reylo fans. Probably because Kylo isn't definitively on any side (which was my ending prediction anyways).

But the way these things have been leaked is way sketchy to me. I'm sure JWT may believe her, but I keep seeing her and others use anonymous sources as proof of the leaks. I simply can't trust that.
@ZioRen

I found it believable at first, but the more I think about it, the more I think she just read the VD.  We know now it was a retail employee who got the shipment ahead of schedule.  I doubt that person was the only one who looked at it.  The Force Ghost stuff might be a good guess.

Also, she lost credibility with me when she said both ants and Reylos will get the good and bad.  Sorry, but if we get ANY hint of Reylo, the ants have lost - period.  There isn't much middle ground there.  If she's talking about Kylo's redemption in the second movie being a bumpy ride, sure - I can buy that.  Still with that wording she seemed to be talking out of both sides of her mouth.
@IoJovi

What if Kylo bertrays Rey but we can see it really isn't a bertryal per se, he has his agenda and Rey would understand. But antis will see it as this, claiming victory. Basically both sides of the barricade seeing it the way they want to, which sort of fits ambiguity statement from Adam and Rian.

I don't think reyloismine has any reason to please antis, been on tumblr for quite some time.
@DarthRen

That's possible but I think it some anons on tumblr told Kylorenema that Kylo and Rey don't betray each other which could be false but I'm thinking would Daisy called their relationship awesome if Kylo betrays her?
@CienaRee

Like I said, bertrayal might not be the right word to use, ambiguity comes into play. We might view it one way, they can view the other because they are antis. I think reyloismine sort of in my opinion implies on this. Antis will get theirs because we've seen them celebrating things that clearly means something different.
@DarthRen

Adam has repeatedly said that Rian trusts that the audience can handle nuance and ambiguity. Personally, I believe in the idea that no side will really have won at the end of the movie. From what I've read above, Kylo and Rey may want to be together but there will be probably something that will prevent them from remaining together after their unexpected alliance. If not, I don't see where would be the romantic drama at all.

And I know that we have a hard time recognizing it as Reylos but there are IMO several hints suggesting that Kylo won't switch side by the end of the movie + Adam repeatedly  saying that he will  have a "truly unexpected fate": that kind of expression was never ever used to describe the fate of any other character. What can make one what want from this but from my side that doesn't scream to me "Kylo leaves the FO to help the Resistance" because this is something so many people want/expect.

The SW database made it pretty clear that Kylo is someone who first and foremost has personal allegiance and that his personal allegiance to Snoke will collide with his personal allegiance to Rey. It doesn't mean through that he will be willing to change his commitment to the FO to join the Resistance.
So the question is: what will he do once he indeed chooses his loyalty to Rey over Snoke's? What would be the obstacle at the heart of the romantic drama by the end of the movie? I.e. the visual dictionary makes pretty clear that he is the one leading the battle of Crait in order to defeat the Resistance. And if that indeed happens after Supremacy:  where the hell is Snoke? Why is Kylo still in charge of the FO ? And the same visual dictionary also hints at Kylo  kinda thirsty for power and cleverly ploting his own path. Plus Rian saying months ago "he is not Vader yet" and the Asian describing him as a "villain we can relate to" (still a villain).

[edit]

I don't know what it means in the end but I don't see why there would be any misdirection in official infos. I think that's fair to the Antis to recognize that not the whole stuff we get screams romantic Reylo in TLJ although I have no doubt it will ultimately happen  by the end of the ST.
@reylo1992

Becoming Vader, Renperor is not something truly unexpected either. Unless Adam is wording the way to hype people.

Renisthekey is faf but I like that idea of Kylo and Snoke using each other and that Kylo wants to get rid of him, but need to go fully dark in rder to do so. People can then debate whether he's doing it for noble reason or selfish. Nuance and ambiguity. Basically rulling in his own way, preferably with his other half Rey and get rid of someone like Snoke. Ruling with iron fist but also not cruel like Snoke, only doing things he meant to do. Rey will probably try to bring him back, creating conflict for him, her and everyone else. She can understand him better than anyone.

I don't think Kylo will be Ben Solo in TLJ or fighting with Resistance, nor will he be under command of Snoke. His own path is the most logical way VD supports.
@DarthRen

Agree that Renperor itself ain't unexpected. IMO the way things are gonna turn depends heavily on what Snoke will do after Supremacy and what will be the consequences of Kylo's actions on his own agenda.

Like I wrote several times, I have a hard time to think that someone like Snoke described as very powerful and at the end of darkness would give up like that, especially if he sees Kylo's betrayal as highly personal.

I've always found that this lines of the novelization and the SW databank are pretty telling in regard to the fact that the allegiance of Kylo to Snoke is personal:

My allegiance is with you
==> Kylo could have said "with the FO"

And you promised me, when it comes to destroy the Resistance, you wouldn't fail me
==> not the FO but me

Kylo swore his allegiance was only to Snoke but he was intrigued when he captured Rey
==> Once again, personal allegiance

Now, I don't know what will happen. If someone I have a close bond with was ploting against me to go his own path and would ultimately betray me at the crucial moment, I would be surely very pissed. And if I would be as dark, powerful and  revengeful as Snoke, I would surely make that person pay for the personal betrayal. And visual dictionary hinting that Snoke is hiding his true nature makes me think that we will only get a glimpse on Supremacy of what the guy is able to do. So I put my money that we won't be done yet with Snoke as the Supremacy arc ends. There is no way IMO that the SW crew would spoil the real climax of the movie the way they do with that scene in the throne room, purposefully hiding what is really going on Crait later.
@reylo1992

Don't forget Kylo Ren is just a role, we might be surprised that he has his own agenda. Being Snoke's lackey is far from interesting, Kylo is plenty powerful by all accounts. He's working on something that might be perceived in both ways good and bad. No doubt Snoke will be powerful but he's also weakened. I don't see Kylo under his command anymore, doing his own thing whatever that is.
@DarthRen

Yeah, Kylo could be very "grey" at the end of TLJ.  The Jediwhinetrick and Kylorenema people did say that he wasn't dark, but he wasn't light either. His agenda might be a mixed bag that Rey may not be prepared to get onboard with yet.
@SoloSideCousin

Pretty much, Kylo being his own man, grey, anti-hero is most likely because I don't think in his own mind he feels that he belongs to the Resistance or FO. He'll see that Snoke is using him but also that he's far too deep in this to just go back to Lea and his family. I can see him ending in a very lonely and dark place but with a sense of purpose and discovery what he has to do and who he wants to be. This might not fly well with Rey, who will be confused by their bond like Kylo but also what he wants to do. Both will develop feelings for each other but not act upon it, wanting to be around one another too many things happening around them or their motives will prevent it. I see a pretty bumpy road but eventually sorting things out.
@DarthRen

If it is so, I still ask myself where does it leave us with Snoke by the end of the movie in that kind of scenario. I really hope that Snoke ain't a sucking villain who will is just meant to make an appearance and go out of screen for the rest of the movie just because two young powerful FS teamed up unexpectedly against him and thus go hiding like a coward while the FO keep battling on Crait.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by SoloSideCousin on Fri 8 Dec - 1:12

@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@CienaRee wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:I wouldn't say she backtracked. Assuming for 2 seconds she's telling the truth the vibe I got was that they have amazing scenes together, an incredible connection and in her opinion things are looking very hopeful for the future of their storyline. HOWEVER, it's not totally smooth sailing (duh). Antis will be happy because there's no kiss, which I'm personally happy to hear.
@FrolickingFizzgig

What I pulled from it is that there's no overt romance and the ending of the movie is going to cause some anxiety for some Reylo fans. Probably because Kylo isn't definitively on any side (which was my ending prediction anyways).

But the way these things have been leaked is way sketchy to me. I'm sure JWT may believe her, but I keep seeing her and others use anonymous sources as proof of the leaks. I simply can't trust that.
@ZioRen

I found it believable at first, but the more I think about it, the more I think she just read the VD.  We know now it was a retail employee who got the shipment ahead of schedule.  I doubt that person was the only one who looked at it.  The Force Ghost stuff might be a good guess.

Also, she lost credibility with me when she said both ants and Reylos will get the good and bad.  Sorry, but if we get ANY hint of Reylo, the ants have lost - period.  There isn't much middle ground there.  If she's talking about Kylo's redemption in the second movie being a bumpy ride, sure - I can buy that.  Still with that wording she seemed to be talking out of both sides of her mouth.
@IoJovi

What if Kylo bertrays Rey but we can see it really isn't a bertryal per se, he has his agenda and Rey would understand. But antis will see it as this, claiming victory. Basically both sides of the barricade seeing it the way they want to, which sort of fits ambiguity statement from Adam and Rian.

I don't think reyloismine has any reason to please antis, been on tumblr for quite some time.
@DarthRen

That's possible but I think it some anons on tumblr told Kylorenema that Kylo and Rey don't betray each other which could be false but I'm thinking would Daisy called their relationship awesome if Kylo betrays her?
@CienaRee

Like I said, bertrayal might not be the right word to use, ambiguity comes into play. We might view it one way, they can view the other because they are antis. I think reyloismine sort of in my opinion implies on this. Antis will get theirs because we've seen them celebrating things that clearly means something different.
@DarthRen

Adam has repeatedly said that Rian trusts that the audience can handle nuance and ambiguity. Personally, I believe in the idea that no side will really have won at the end of the movie. From what I've read above, Kylo and Rey may want to be together but there will be probably something that will prevent them from remaining together after their unexpected alliance. If not, I don't see where would be the romantic drama at all.

And I know that we have a hard time recognizing it as Reylos but there are IMO several hints suggesting that Kylo won't switch side by the end of the movie + Adam repeatedly  saying that he will  have a "truly unexpected fate": that kind of expression was never ever used to describe the fate of any other character. What can make one what want from this but from my side that doesn't scream to me "Kylo leaves the FO to help the Resistance" because this is something so many people want/expect.

The SW database made it pretty clear that Kylo is someone who first and foremost has personal allegiance and that his personal allegiance to Snoke will collide with his personal allegiance to Rey. It doesn't mean through that he will be willing to change his commitment to the FO to join the Resistance.
So the question is: what will he do once he indeed chooses his loyalty to Rey over Snoke's? What would be the obstacle at the heart of the romantic drama by the end of the movie? I.e. the visual dictionary makes pretty clear that he is the one leading the battle of Crait in order to defeat the Resistance. And if that indeed happens after Supremacy:  where the hell is Snoke? Why is Kylo still in charge of the FO ? And the same visual dictionary also hints at Kylo  kinda thirsty for power and cleverly ploting his own path. Plus Rian saying months ago "he is not Vader yet" and the Asian describing him as a "villain we can relate to" (still a villain).

[edit]

I don't know what it means in the end but I don't see why there would be any misdirection in official infos. I think that's fair to the Antis to recognize that not the whole stuff we get screams romantic Reylo in TLJ although I have no doubt it will ultimately happen  by the end of the ST.
@reylo1992

Becoming Vader, Renperor is not something truly unexpected either. Unless Adam is wording the way to hype people.

Renisthekey is faf but I like that idea of Kylo and Snoke using each other and that Kylo wants to get rid of him, but need to go fully dark in rder to do so. People can then debate whether he's doing it for noble reason or selfish. Nuance and ambiguity. Basically rulling in his own way, preferably with his other half Rey and get rid of someone like Snoke. Ruling with iron fist but also not cruel like Snoke, only doing things he meant to do. Rey will probably try to bring him back, creating conflict for him, her and everyone else. She can understand him better than anyone.

I don't think Kylo will be Ben Solo in TLJ or fighting with Resistance, nor will he be under command of Snoke. His own path is the most logical way VD supports.
@DarthRen

Agree that Renperor itself ain't unexpected. IMO the way things are gonna turn depends heavily on what Snoke will do after Supremacy and what will be the consequences of Kylo's actions on his own agenda.

Like I wrote several times, I have a hard time to think that someone like Snoke described as very powerful and at the end of darkness would give up like that, especially if he sees Kylo's betrayal as highly personal.

I've always found that this lines of the novelization and the SW databank are pretty telling in regard to the fact that the allegiance of Kylo to Snoke is personal:

My allegiance is with you
==> Kylo could have said "with the FO"

And you promised me, when it comes to destroy the Resistance, you wouldn't fail me
==> not the FO but me

Kylo swore his allegiance was only to Snoke but he was intrigued when he captured Rey
==> Once again, personal allegiance

Now, I don't know what will happen. If someone I have a close bond with was ploting against me to go his own path and would ultimately betray me at the crucial moment, I would be surely very pissed. And if I would be as dark, powerful and  revengeful as Snoke, I would surely make that person pay for the personal betrayal. And visual dictionary hinting that Snoke is hiding his true nature makes me think that we will only get a glimpse on Supremacy of what the guy is able to do. So I put my money that we won't be done yet with Snoke as the Supremacy arc ends. There is no way IMO that the SW crew would spoil the real climax of the movie the way they do with that scene in the throne room, purposefully hiding what is really going on Crait later.
@reylo1992

Don't forget Kylo Ren is just a role, we might be surprised that he has his own agenda. Being Snoke's lackey is far from interesting, Kylo is plenty powerful by all accounts. He's working on something that might be perceived in both ways good and bad. No doubt Snoke will be powerful but he's also weakened. I don't see Kylo under his command anymore, doing his own thing whatever that is.
@DarthRen

Yeah, Kylo could be very "grey" at the end of TLJ.  The Jediwhinetrick and Kylorenema people did say that he wasn't dark, but he wasn't light either. His agenda might be a mixed bag that Rey may not be prepared to get onboard with yet.
@SoloSideCousin

Pretty much, Kylo being his own man, grey, anti-hero is most likely because I don't think in his own mind he feels that he belongs to the Resistance or FO. He'll see that Snoke is using him but also that he's far too deep in this to just go back to Lea and his family. I can see him ending in a very lonely and dark place but with a sense of purpose and discovery what he has to do and who he wants to be. This might not fly well with Rey, who will be confused by their bond like Kylo but also what he wants to do. Both will develop feelings for each other but not act upon it, wanting to be around one another too many things happening around them or their motives will prevent it. I see a pretty bumpy road but eventually sorting things out.
@DarthRen

If it is so, I still ask myself where does it leave us with Snoke by the end of the movie in that kind of scenario. I really hope that Snoke ain't a sucking villain who will is just meant to make an appearance and go out of screen for the rest of the movie just because two young powerful FS teamed up unexpectedly against him and thus go hiding like a coward while the FO keep battling on Crait.  
@reylo1992

It would depend on how they do it. If Snoke escapes to the Unknown Regions, then there is a lot of potential for force plot expansion and just general sci-fi weirdness in IX. Snoke in the end may not end up being that-that important. He and whatever he comes from may just be the vehicle around which Kylo and Rey discover themselves and the mysteries of the force.

I know that sounds weird, but think of Voldemort. You didn't have to see him a lot, but he provided the catalyst for so much of the trio's journey. IOW, he forced them to face and learn extraordinary things about themselves and magic that they never would have faced under normal circumstances. I think it will be similar with Snoke.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Darth_Awakened on Fri 8 Dec - 1:39

@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@MoonFyre wrote:Guys, actually I chatted with Reyloismine in tumblr for a bit few days ago, when she just got back from the screening. She didn't give much specific info but she did tell me this:

- Yes there are Reylo scenes. But good and bad ones. Brace yourself

I asked her if one of the bad scenes is Kylo turning Rey over to Snoke. She didn't want to answer that because it's toward the end of the movie. But she rated Reylo 8/10 overall (she said she might be biased though) and said the good scenes outweigh the bad.

I also told her that I don't expect a full blown romance between them in TLJ, only that they will come into an understanding and become allies. She replied with the gif of Tina Fey sealing her lips lol. Then I asked her if I got it right.

Reyloismine: Half of it is wrong.

Me: So they'll just become allies but still at odds?

Reyloismine: Somewhat Razz

Make of that what you will.
@MoonFyre

Well I can't imagine them becoming allies and not coming to an understanding, so it must be the other way around! To me, this sounds like what some people have been speculating: Kylo potentially ends TLJ on no side.
@ZioRen

I think you are right. I think that she will have an understanding with him, but he will be his own rogue guy. If the Kylorenema/Jediwhinetrick stuff is right, then that information supports this conclusion as well. Basically there is a strong connection between them, but outside forces are keeping them apart. Super romantic drama there. Very Happy I hope those Kylorenema and Jediwhinetrick people are on the level, because I like those leaks a lot.
@SoloSideCousin

I like those two leaks a lot. And all of the suff I'am reading here.

I also tend to agree with @"KrazyForKyo" on TFA being a Rorschach test when it comes to interpretation. And I even don't have antis in mind - we, Reylos, we're intepreting the things differently.
And when you apply the same thing to the latest leaks: some of it definitely could be a result of a different interpretation of the fact, especially when it comes to "reading" of the characters interactions with other characters.  

I have confident that Reylos would see the things more clearly than other part of the fandom (we have now the ultimate  proof in the marketing campaign that Reylos are definitely capable of interpreting things), but it always comes to nuances and personal projections of tiny bits in it

I do belive though we're getting a bunch of Reylo moments and feels. But the ultimate experience of it (are their interactions mostly "bad" or "good") can't be conveyed at all by the leakers - because it's highly personal.

**I hope - I dont' sound confusing**


Last edited by Darth_Awakened on Fri 8 Dec - 4:19; edited 1 time in total
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by DarthRen on Fri 8 Dec - 1:52

@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@SoloSideCousin wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@reylo1992 wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@CienaRee wrote:
@DarthRen wrote:
@IoJovi wrote:
@ZioRen wrote:
@FrolickingFizzgig wrote:I wouldn't say she backtracked. Assuming for 2 seconds she's telling the truth the vibe I got was that they have amazing scenes together, an incredible connection and in her opinion things are looking very hopeful for the future of their storyline. HOWEVER, it's not totally smooth sailing (duh). Antis will be happy because there's no kiss, which I'm personally happy to hear.
@FrolickingFizzgig

What I pulled from it is that there's no overt romance and the ending of the movie is going to cause some anxiety for some Reylo fans. Probably because Kylo isn't definitively on any side (which was my ending prediction anyways).

But the way these things have been leaked is way sketchy to me. I'm sure JWT may believe her, but I keep seeing her and others use anonymous sources as proof of the leaks. I simply can't trust that.
@ZioRen

I found it believable at first, but the more I think about it, the more I think she just read the VD.  We know now it was a retail employee who got the shipment ahead of schedule.  I doubt that person was the only one who looked at it.  The Force Ghost stuff might be a good guess.

Also, she lost credibility with me when she said both ants and Reylos will get the good and bad.  Sorry, but if we get ANY hint of Reylo, the ants have lost - period.  There isn't much middle ground there.  If she's talking about Kylo's redemption in the second movie being a bumpy ride, sure - I can buy that.  Still with that wording she seemed to be talking out of both sides of her mouth.
@IoJovi

What if Kylo bertrays Rey but we can see it really isn't a bertryal per se, he has his agenda and Rey would understand. But antis will see it as this, claiming victory. Basically both sides of the barricade seeing it the way they want to, which sort of fits ambiguity statement from Adam and Rian.

I don't think reyloismine has any reason to please antis, been on tumblr for quite some time.
@DarthRen

That's possible but I think it some anons on tumblr told Kylorenema that Kylo and Rey don't betray each other which could be false but I'm thinking would Daisy called their relationship awesome if Kylo betrays her?
@CienaRee

Like I said, bertrayal might not be the right word to use, ambiguity comes into play. We might view it one way, they can view the other because they are antis. I think reyloismine sort of in my opinion implies on this. Antis will get theirs because we've seen them celebrating things that clearly means something different.
@DarthRen

Adam has repeatedly said that Rian trusts that the audience can handle nuance and ambiguity. Personally, I believe in the idea that no side will really have won at the end of the movie. From what I've read above, Kylo and Rey may want to be together but there will be probably something that will prevent them from remaining together after their unexpected alliance. If not, I don't see where would be the romantic drama at all.

And I know that we have a hard time recognizing it as Reylos but there are IMO several hints suggesting that Kylo won't switch side by the end of the movie + Adam repeatedly  saying that he will  have a "truly unexpected fate": that kind of expression was never ever used to describe the fate of any other character. What can make one what want from this but from my side that doesn't scream to me "Kylo leaves the FO to help the Resistance" because this is something so many people want/expect.

The SW database made it pretty clear that Kylo is someone who first and foremost has personal allegiance and that his personal allegiance to Snoke will collide with his personal allegiance to Rey. It doesn't mean through that he will be willing to change his commitment to the FO to join the Resistance.
So the question is: what will he do once he indeed chooses his loyalty to Rey over Snoke's? What would be the obstacle at the heart of the romantic drama by the end of the movie? I.e. the visual dictionary makes pretty clear that he is the one leading the battle of Crait in order to defeat the Resistance. And if that indeed happens after Supremacy:  where the hell is Snoke? Why is Kylo still in charge of the FO ? And the same visual dictionary also hints at Kylo  kinda thirsty for power and cleverly ploting his own path. Plus Rian saying months ago "he is not Vader yet" and the Asian describing him as a "villain we can relate to" (still a villain).

[edit]

I don't know what it means in the end but I don't see why there would be any misdirection in official infos. I think that's fair to the Antis to recognize that not the whole stuff we get screams romantic Reylo in TLJ although I have no doubt it will ultimately happen  by the end of the ST.
@reylo1992

Becoming Vader, Renperor is not something truly unexpected either. Unless Adam is wording the way to hype people.

Renisthekey is faf but I like that idea of Kylo and Snoke using each other and that Kylo wants to get rid of him, but need to go fully dark in rder to do so. People can then debate whether he's doing it for noble reason or selfish. Nuance and ambiguity. Basically rulling in his own way, preferably with his other half Rey and get rid of someone like Snoke. Ruling with iron fist but also not cruel like Snoke, only doing things he meant to do. Rey will probably try to bring him back, creating conflict for him, her and everyone else. She can understand him better than anyone.

I don't think Kylo will be Ben Solo in TLJ or fighting with Resistance, nor will he be under command of Snoke. His own path is the most logical way VD supports.
@DarthRen

Agree that Renperor itself ain't unexpected. IMO the way things are gonna turn depends heavily on what Snoke will do after Supremacy and what will be the consequences of Kylo's actions on his own agenda.

Like I wrote several times, I have a hard time to think that someone like Snoke described as very powerful and at the end of darkness would give up like that, especially if he sees Kylo's betrayal as highly personal.

I've always found that this lines of the novelization and the SW databank are pretty telling in regard to the fact that the allegiance of Kylo to Snoke is personal:

My allegiance is with you
==> Kylo could have said "with the FO"

And you promised me, when it comes to destroy the Resistance, you wouldn't fail me
==> not the FO but me

Kylo swore his allegiance was only to Snoke but he was intrigued when he captured Rey
==> Once again, personal allegiance

Now, I don't know what will happen. If someone I have a close bond with was ploting against me to go his own path and would ultimately betray me at the crucial moment, I would be surely very pissed. And if I would be as dark, powerful and  revengeful as Snoke, I would surely make that person pay for the personal betrayal. And visual dictionary hinting that Snoke is hiding his true nature makes me think that we will only get a glimpse on Supremacy of what the guy is able to do. So I put my money that we won't be done yet with Snoke as the Supremacy arc ends. There is no way IMO that the SW crew would spoil the real climax of the movie the way they do with that scene in the throne room, purposefully hiding what is really going on Crait later.
@reylo1992

Don't forget Kylo Ren is just a role, we might be surprised that he has his own agenda. Being Snoke's lackey is far from interesting, Kylo is plenty powerful by all accounts. He's working on something that might be perceived in both ways good and bad. No doubt Snoke will be powerful but he's also weakened. I don't see Kylo under his command anymore, doing his own thing whatever that is.
@DarthRen

Yeah, Kylo could be very "grey" at the end of TLJ.  The Jediwhinetrick and Kylorenema people did say that he wasn't dark, but he wasn't light either. His agenda might be a mixed bag that Rey may not be prepared to get onboard with yet.
@SoloSideCousin

Pretty much, Kylo being his own man, grey, anti-hero is most likely because I don't think in his own mind he feels that he belongs to the Resistance or FO. He'll see that Snoke is using him but also that he's far too deep in this to just go back to Lea and his family. I can see him ending in a very lonely and dark place but with a sense of purpose and discovery what he has to do and who he wants to be. This might not fly well with Rey, who will be confused by their bond like Kylo but also what he wants to do. Both will develop feelings for each other but not act upon it, wanting to be around one another too many things happening around them or their motives will prevent it. I see a pretty bumpy road but eventually sorting things out.
@DarthRen

If it is so, I still ask myself where does it leave us with Snoke by the end of the movie in that kind of scenario. I really hope that Snoke ain't a sucking villain who will is just meant to make an appearance and go out of screen for the rest of the movie just because two young powerful FS teamed up unexpectedly against him and thus go hiding like a coward while the FO keep battling on Crait.  
@reylo1992

Honestly, I don't care much for Snoke because something tells me he's not even that important besides being nefarious, manipulative creep. Kylo and Rey are as new characters when it comes to the force are far more important. I don't want an underwhelming villain in Snoke but far more care about other aspects. Snoke will be shown as reasonably powerful but not over the top, because he's weakened any why else would needed Kylo. it seems they need each other, doubt or hope not that Kylo is only serving him and hopefully plotting against him, his own path.
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by Night Huntress on Fri 8 Dec - 1:54

@reylo1992 wrote:
I also give her to benefit of doubt. To be fair to Reyloismine, if 600 persons would PM me to ask about spoilers, I would have a hard time answering to all of them and choosing who I answer to.
@reylo1992

Yeah, but what did she expected will happen when she openly claims on Tumblr to have seen the movie?
Of course people will ask her questions and doubt her... so why would anybody even admit to have seen it?
Because of attention- that's why. Rolling Eyes
Even if she's telling the truth, it wasn't a nice move to spill it.
Don't kiss and tell - in this case don't see an tell.
All this leakers claim to have seen it, but neither have the courage to give away anything really, so better shut the hell up and don't tease!

Sorry, but I have to let out my frustration and anger over this people. Mad
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Re: Discussion: TLJ Movie Spoilers/Rumors

Post by SkyStar on Fri 8 Dec - 3:25

She probably got overwhelmed when seeing the movie and didn't wait a bit to calm the emotions down. Happens. I know it's annoying and everybody is tense, but it doesn't mean she was abusing the power, maybe she just didn't think it out that in the end, it could have been better to do it in a different way or not to do it at all. Even if she wanted the attention.
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